Hey guys, I need some advice.
Added 2019-01-13 19:58:58 +0000 UTCOver the last few months we've seen a big drop in patrongage. Not people leaving, we still have the same number of fans here as always... just people downgrading the amount they pledge at. Going from $20 or $10 a month, down to $1 a month.
And, it's really hurting the family, financially. We've lost nearly a third of our income from Patreon, and it's hurting.
I was hoping I could get some advice from you guys on how I could make larger pledges more desirable, so people would want to keep them.
One of the difficulties I've had with the rewards I give you...most of you guys have everything! If you've bought all the albums, I have very little free songs to offer. If you've bought the games...same thing. All last year I released new songs to you guys months before the album came out, but I have no idea how much you guys were into that.
Exclusive offers get tricky, too. If I make somthing new, say a music video or a game or a song, and I release it only to high pledging patrons, it's actaully hurting the future of the band...for a couple bucks a month. The art we put out helps keep us going not just financially, but from a publicity stand point. When I do exclusive offerings, we sort of disappear to everyone, but high pledging patreons. For example, we released a new music video a few days ago. If that had been exclusive to patreons above the $5 a month point, it might have motivated fans to up their pledges...but then we wouldn't have released anything to the rest of the world in months.
So what kinds of things do you think would entice patreons to higher pledge levels?
We really count on your guys, so this means everything to us.
Comments
I think a lot of it is not you guys but rather stuff like this. I love the perks and it is cool you want to make sure you give people what they want too. I have seen a lot of drops the past year in many different artists. I follow many but can only afford to support a couple right now. There have been artists like Julien-K who do things such as crowdfund a new album on indigogo and have done very well with that as well but that is not monthly things. Some popular perks I see are Skype chats with artists on higher levels, personalized or autographed lyric sheets and memorobilia, names in album. Or. Video credits, getting a monthly letter from an artist or band, etc. Sometimes that can draw in people too to the higher tiers. I seen one artist who had a large option which gave the people vip access at concerts of choice etc. There's so many options. I can go and look at some of the ones most popular and let you know. Just suggestions.
Tamara (IsukiKane)
2019-11-10 18:22:08 +0000 UTCSorry to hear about your hard times! Thanks for letting me know. I always worry when people downgrade that I did somthing wrong.
Abney Park
2019-11-10 18:14:01 +0000 UTCI had to downgrade temporarily because I hit hard times. I will go back up as soon as my financial situation is better.
Tamara (IsukiKane)
2019-11-10 17:35:15 +0000 UTCSent a message on here with some suggestions. You and other artists with a strong fan base shouldn’t have to struggle.
Becky Brooks
2019-02-09 02:33:34 +0000 UTCThank you so much, Becky! I just saw that you did indeed raise your pledge. To be honest, I only started Patreon our of necessity. 5 years ago, before sites like Spotify came to be the norm, we made plenty of money. But the industry has changed, and without Spotify we would not be able to make it.
Abney Park
2019-02-09 02:27:19 +0000 UTCI was initially averse to Patreon, thinking of it as akin to buying friends. But realized that patronage traces further back than the Roman Republic. Supporting an artist you admire brings as much joy as buying a piece of artwork to enjoy every day. We listen to Abney Park almost exclusively since discovering your music at the last Gaslight Gathering in San Diego. We don’t pretend to have a friendship, but at least we know that you appreciate all of us here. I’ll spread the word to my friends. Sounds like every little bit helps. *raises pledge*
Becky Brooks
2019-02-08 23:03:17 +0000 UTCThis will be long, but please bear with me, even though this is way late and might not even get seen... To start positive; I don't support many creators on Patreon, and I'm only giving more money a month to one other creator, but not by much, even though I'm far from high tier with you, either. And I do it because I enjoy your work. I'm one of those that have maintained my level, I don't need to lower it. The level I'm at is what I feel I can afford, given what I get. Now I'll be frank. I'm not a rabid fan. I don't own all your albums and I don't feel the need to. I don't need to own all your games; as though they seem fun, I have enough problems getting my friends and family to play the games I already own. I need to be picky (It also doesn't help that the A.C.E. game I purchased were missing a piece when it arrived. I never got around to contacting you about that, my fault). And though I would love to go to one of your concerts at least once, I can't afford nor care to spend a thousand dollars to travel thousands of kilometres just for that (I don't think you've ever played at a venue closer than a thousand km to me... Totally understandable, there's not that many people here.). I like to have albums as a physical medium, with the album art, I don't really need the downloads. And finally, in this depressing list; I have no need for early access. As simple as that. If what is released to higher tiers on Patreon is going to be released for everybody on other platforms later anyway, I have the patience to wait. What COULD make me eat less and raise my pledge even more, would be _truly_ exclusive content, not published anywhere else. And content that is released often. It doesn't need to be songs or music videos, as that would not be worth it for you, as you said (at least until you get enough Patreons to actually pay for it), but it could be things that you won't release to the general public anyway. Like early drafts of songs or art, discarded album art, bad recordings of jam sessions, or like someone else said; songs or art in progress that we could help you with developing. It could also be Patreon exclusive short and informal livestreams, like five-ten minutes were you're answering questions from the chat, or short vlog-like unlisted Youtube videos just talking about projects or life in general. Things that make you happy, or things that worry you. Twitch or Youtube has functions like Superchat, where we can donate directly during the livestream, too (though at least Youtube takes like 50% of the donations...). You can be as personal as you wish on these (I'm not saying to stream or record from the bathtub like Barnacules has been known to do to his Patreons), and you just need an internet connection and your phone. If such livestreams or vlog videos are available to all who pledge at least $1, it might be an incentive for more people to join, too. Just a bit of advice, though: It would be a good idea to vary the time for each such livestream, to let people from different timezones tune in. Afternoon for you would be midnight for me, and even worse for those east of here... Other than that, like many have said; advertise your Patreon more. With more Patreons, you might not be as vulnerable to some of them lowering their pledge, as you seem to be now.
Mirandur
2019-01-27 13:17:40 +0000 UTCYou just select the new tier. The old one will be automatically upgraded.
Mirandur
2019-01-27 12:21:04 +0000 UTCI think adding to the overall numbers will really be the thing. Lots of first tier supports will be more stable a few top tier ones. I don't pledge because I want something in particular. I do it so the band exists. I think those are the people you need to capture.
Lora Friedenthal
2019-01-22 18:14:59 +0000 UTCI appreciate your commitment to all fans by not doing exclusive songs only available on the rare, out-of-print 4CD version of the album. One thing that might encourage extra spending on the part of those of us who can, without alienating those who can't, could be some of the studio demo versions, raw recording sessions, and the like. You've already done pre-release versions and offered instrumental tracks (thank you for not making these overly hard to find or ridiculously expensive)--maybe more of that, or live versions.
Jonathan Coolidge
2019-01-19 14:48:54 +0000 UTCIt is a bugger of a thing. I can sympathize, as I have been bouncing from short term contract to short term contract, it can very financially restrictive. It is a bit of a catch 22 situation, you can make exclusive things for the higher tiers, but that takes time and resources, which would take you away from the normal tiers and potentially alienated the main stayers. Applying my engineering mind to it, the solution is drink more beer. Hmmm, helping but at the same time not helping. The only other thing I can really think of is exclusive content of a behind the scenes video of the making of a clip, or if you do any steam punk projects, do a DYI video of it. My preference is a DYI guide of your costumes being made. Or the easy out, with the higher tiers virtual parties every now and then. Which I understand that there is probably a lot of effort to set these things up.
Micheal Elliott
2019-01-18 09:01:50 +0000 UTCQuork Q'Tar has some very good insight. I don't, unfortunately. Your levels of perks are right-on with another band that is on Patreon I follow. The answer does appear to be to keep attracting new Patrons, so those that rotate down don't have such an impact and Quork's ideas sound like a good way to go. I also would LOVE insight into the older songs. I buy everything you put out there, but I do feel special hearing a song or two from each album before it is out. I am seriously considering dropping my Netflix subscription and upping Patreon to you. I hardly ever watch Netflix and I listen to Abney Park nearly daily. (do not see how up a level though, so if someone could point the way.. do you join a new tier and then cancel the older one?).
Laurie Bell
2019-01-18 00:52:16 +0000 UTCSecond part: Me as patron - getting a view behind the stage (work in progress, shots from studio sessions, outtakes) is always great stuff - maybe you could revisit some old stuff from time to time, tell anecdotes from earlier times, show old songs and tell us their story (I know, the pre-steampunk era doesn't represent your artistic vision any more; but still those are great songs (The wake, Breathe, Dear Ophelia - I love them) and are still part of your history). - I know it isn't much in numbers, but I'll reassign my Patreon funds, lower pledges on well financed projects and give more to others, you'll obviously be on the rising side ;-)
Quork Q'Tar
2019-01-15 15:02:23 +0000 UTCI wish I had a good answer to you other than keep trying to get more patrons. I only ever give at the level I'm comfortable with long term but others don't always follow that logic. As a purchaser of all your music and RPG stuffs (finances have been tight or I would be buying up all your games and books as well) I can see the dilemma you face. If I think of anything that may help I'll either post it here for you or message you on Face Book. I'm the random fan who keeps wishing you an awesometastcial or epicrifical day <3
Jennifer Townsend
2019-01-15 04:26:30 +0000 UTCI'll split my answer in two. This first one is from my perspective as someone with a little bit of experience at the point of view of a creator (not me myself, but a friend of mine who's an award-winning Fantasy author; I convinced her to get here and assist her with much of the work related to Patreon), the second one will be from my perspective as a fan and patron of yours. I think raising the number is the main way to go, rather than trying to keep/raise pledge levels. Many people with low pledges are a more robust base than few people with high pledges. It's hard to tell, but I think having flyers about Patreon and adding them everywhere we can is what gained most of the attention we got for Patreon. In your case that would mean: Put them in every CD box. Send them with merch people buy. Stick them into books and games. Distribute them wherever you're in person (concerts, Steampunk conventions, ...). Always have some of them on you (that means everyone in the band family, technical support, core fans, family) just in case you randomly meet someone interested; you never know what might come of it. The flyers I've designed for her cover three main topics, and I think it's important to cover all of them. I called them "why Patreon?" (covering what Patreon is, how it functions, what it means for artists and how it works for patrons), "why me?" (covering why she chose to use Patreon and how raising funding there aids her artistic career; it boils down to the basic equation "more money on Patreon = less time to be invested in nonartistic paid work = more time for artistic work = more books") and "why you?" (covering both the perks and benefits of being a patron and the fact supporting an artist is simply a good deed). Maybe experiment a bit, test whether having standalone Patreon flyers or adding a Patreon section to other flyers you might have (discography? merch catalogue? I've never seen your printed marketing material, there's not much of that from you on this side of the ocean). In our case I feel standalone flyers were the right decision, but this can be completely different for you. Maybe even add a (short) Patreon section to the CD booklets? All types of early access content seem to be the most efficient way of rewarding patrons. There's one thing we haven't done yet, but are going to do - meaning I have no experience at all whether it really works, but I have a very strong feeling it will work: Patrons will get to see some short stories as work in progress and have the chance to have an impact on the final, published text. I think this might be worth a try for you as well. Maybe show your patrons some lyrics you're working on, asking them for suggestions or ideas? Let them witness and maybe even influence the creative process. Give them the feeling of being part of the whole thing. Obviously don't go further down that track than you're comfortable with. If you aren't comfortable with any interference in your regular artistic work, maybe have a separate project for Patreon; one song where you let your supporting fans add their ideas and wishes. Generally speaking: Early access (which you're doing already) probably is the best way of giving your patrons an exclusive benefit while avoiding the trap of Patreon-only, exclusive artistic work. I hope my text isn't too confused, my significant other found a leftover bottle of christmas wine xD Let's see whether I'll manage to write that other part today or whether I'll wait for tomorrow...^^
Quork Q'Tar
2019-01-15 02:32:34 +0000 UTCWell, thanks for helping as much as you can! Maybe I need to focus on adding to the number of people here.
Abney Park
2019-01-14 17:45:23 +0000 UTCI, like most folks who have posted here, have downgraded because of finances. Aging parents, family with health issues, it all adds up. It's nothing against the band or what you are doing, it's just the uncertainty of the current financial environment tied with the issues I mentioned.
Joe Johnson
2019-01-14 17:44:09 +0000 UTCI'm all about supporting the band, the goodies are less of an incentive for the reasons you stated -- I already have all the music, which is what I care about most. IMO, it's totally cool to make certain content for Patrons First -- and then, a month later, release the same content for the fans in general. You have to keep yourselves out there for everybody.... I would love to see some content featuring the "Steampunk First Family." Give us a five minute interview with Kristina, or let the girls interview Skye or Derek, etc. You could go almost "reality tv" but in brief format.
James Magruder
2019-01-14 15:36:09 +0000 UTCI don't know much about maintaining a Patreon but William's suggestion seems like a very good idea. You could also program a monthly Q&A session on streaming only for patreons of a certain tier. Maybe you could make a series of short, fun videos about "how to live the steampunk life on a daily basis" since you seem to have a suitable home to do so. Since you have a studio at home, you could even consider recording every now and then a different version of one of your songs (like a capella or piano version) strictly for the high-tier patrons, that sort of thing. As a side note, most people probably don't even know you are on Patreon: put a link to your patreon account on your website and Youtube channel can be a good way to "advertise" your Patreon in a simple, non-intrusive way. It is all I can think about for now, I really hope you will find a way ton find a way to sort things out.
Calirohé
2019-01-14 12:44:08 +0000 UTCI love this idea! I will do this this month!!
Abney Park
2019-01-14 02:27:30 +0000 UTCOnce upon a time, you posted a video on how you took an ordinary pair of pants, and steampunked it. I greatly enjoyed it, watched it several times for ideas and techniques. What do you think about getting involved with Patreon fans efforts to steampunk their stuff? Different levels could get written response, quickie Photoshop's, video responses, just brainstorming here... and we could all see the results. I'd pay to see that. I also just remembered the steampunked flat screen TV video...
William Moss
2019-01-14 02:26:07 +0000 UTCWell, thanks for doing what you can!
Abney Park
2019-01-14 00:29:06 +0000 UTCI can’t give much advice, all I can say is I’ve had to downgrade purely because money is tight, and I support several artists on Patreon. One is a personal friend and so gets a lot of attention from me, one I’ve been a high level supporter for since she started on Patreon. So they’ve stayed at the top of my list. The rest of my Patreon artists I’ve just had to downgrade for a little while, at least until money isn’t so tight when I can put it back up again. Nothing to do with what you’re offering, just purely financial. Peace and love!
Andy W Marsden
2019-01-14 00:12:21 +0000 UTCI think I tried to download one of your earlier albums - to give to a friend - it was $17. I'm not too worried now, although I am still waiting for the Goodiebag I ordered back in November - I live in Australia, so postage will take longer, but I was hoping for it before Christmas. - - I have emailed you .
Barbara Medhurst
2019-01-13 23:51:18 +0000 UTCI done understand. The coupon code is typically for $12, just to make sure. And album download is $9. Was it more then a standard album download? Like the live double album or something? Sorry that happened...strange thing I’ve never heard of happening.
Abney Park
2019-01-13 23:43:31 +0000 UTCI nearly dropped pledge level not that long ago because the last time I tried to download a 'free' album it was going to cost me $2 - - it's not so much the $2, but all the rooting around to pay it. I buy all your albums and figurines etc and I've been pledging at Platinum for 2 years (next month) and I just felt a little insulted as I rarely 'cash in' a monthly treat - - however, I have a '3 day rule' - - cool off for 3 days and if an issue still pi$$es you off - then do something - - well, after 3 days I realised I still love your work and you still give me joy when I hear your band - - I will continue to pledge while I am financially able.
Barbara Medhurst
2019-01-13 23:40:35 +0000 UTCYou're welcome captain!
Silver Fox
2019-01-13 23:00:11 +0000 UTCThanks for doing as much as you do!
Abney Park
2019-01-13 22:58:52 +0000 UTCYeah, that seems to be a theame.
Abney Park
2019-01-13 22:58:41 +0000 UTCIt's finances. I'm at the pledge level I'm at because that's what I can afford.
Silver Fox
2019-01-13 22:57:33 +0000 UTCFor me, it’s simply a financial thing. I plan to up my pledge as soon as I can afford to, again.
Noël Frodelius-Fujimoto
2019-01-13 22:50:57 +0000 UTCFor as long as I can ps the chronicals are fab
Craig Giddings
2019-01-13 22:41:06 +0000 UTCThat’s sucks, man. Thank you for sticking around!
Abney Park
2019-01-13 22:40:14 +0000 UTCI’m a self employed driving instructor I lost £2500+ last year due to car issues it all adds up
Craig Giddings
2019-01-13 22:39:40 +0000 UTCYeah, it’s thought for everybody. I assumed that was a lot of people’s reasons...especially around the holidays .
Abney Park
2019-01-13 22:37:33 +0000 UTCAs llga has said I pledge to support the band not for perks though you guys have to understand that we have jobs and bills to pay too maybe our Circumstances have changed I will be totally up front I’m close to cancelling my Patreonage at the moment not because of you guys I will support anyway I can but because my circumstances have changed and I am struggling to make ends meet
Craig Giddings
2019-01-13 22:36:16 +0000 UTCI'd love more behind the scenes clips. They don't have to be refined either. Pics and short clips from practice sessions. Bits of lyrics, or photos of lyrics written on rum-soaked bar napkins. Anything that helps us see what's going on. Stuff where you might think "This isn't refined enough for general Instagram/Facebook, but maybe our more devoted fans would appreciate it".
Scott Boding
2019-01-13 22:33:49 +0000 UTCI don't know what to say. I pledge for the good feeling I get for helping an artist I admire. The perks are just a nicety.
Terence L. Turnovsky
2019-01-13 22:22:13 +0000 UTCMore frequent posts on the band and process. Perhaps photos of concerts, back stage, in the studio, on travel.
Mark Dowman
2019-01-13 22:06:48 +0000 UTCI'd consider upping my pledge level. It just won't be in the coming months since my own economy is going to be reduced.
Daniel Blom Paulsen
2019-01-13 21:34:15 +0000 UTCStreaming your practicing sessions is a great look inside the band, but they seem to happen when I'm at work. Maybe more of the inside the band stuff, personally I enjoy the tutorials and projects that you show us.
Kirsten Weispfenning
2019-01-13 21:01:02 +0000 UTCI feel the same as Ilga Paul in that the pledge is to support you in being able to continue producing music. The perks are nice but not the main reason for the pledge level I am at.
Philip Stevens
2019-01-13 21:00:24 +0000 UTCI can send you some venue suggestions
Ilga Paul
2019-01-13 20:54:26 +0000 UTCWe’ve been trying! Blue bird theater, our typical venue, has been non responsive. So we need another place
Abney Park
2019-01-13 20:52:58 +0000 UTCI don't think I am in your typical fan age group, so my thoughts may not be very relevant to most of your fans. I view my pledge as primarily a gesture of support and loyalty, so the perks aren't a huge motivation. That being said, what I really miss is attending an Abney Park concert. Please, please, please come to Colorado!
Ilga Paul
2019-01-13 20:47:45 +0000 UTCWell, thank you very much for that!
Abney Park
2019-01-13 20:26:11 +0000 UTCSort of. I think you do a dowload code a month. I just want 1 or 2 a year to catch new albums only. I already own everything else. :-) If it was, 15 - 20 a month, I'm in.
Stephen Opipari
2019-01-13 20:24:55 +0000 UTCWell, I don't have any brilliant ideas for you, but I can bump my pledge level. I'll poke at a couple of my people I keep buying albums for. See if I can't get them to put the word out.
Willard Phule
2019-01-13 20:21:14 +0000 UTCHonestly, it’s not the time, it’s the cost. I hired a cast for this, and pay them...but with the money we make from Patreon going down I can no longer pay hundreds of dollars to voice actors. :( That said, I’ll see if I can get another release this week. I paid ahead for a few actors, so I might still have chapters I can make without spending more money.
Abney Park
2019-01-13 20:11:15 +0000 UTCSo, interestingly, that IS offered as a perk for higher levels. Above a certain level you get a free download led album every month. I post codes here, that you use on our site. Is that what you mean?
Abney Park
2019-01-13 20:10:30 +0000 UTCThe one thing I'd like to see that would entice me to pay a higher pledge level is access to new albums as a download as they come out. I know that's probably a huge slug of dough for you though and might not be practical. That being said, if you did Vinyl releases...I'd still buy them regardless of a digital version.
Stephen Opipari
2019-01-13 20:06:54 +0000 UTCThe Chronicles are a big deal to me, but that has to be time intensive for you.
Willard Phule
2019-01-13 20:05:18 +0000 UTC
