Duckfeed Presents: The Rebuttalfield Episode 1, Diablo 3
Added 2019-03-01 21:04:12 +0000 UTCI got real cranky thinking about Diablo 3 and decided to talk about it. Put 30 minutes on the clock!
Comments
Can Gary rebut again please?
Cinnamon Toast Cunt
2023-10-16 16:00:30 +0000 UTCD2 and Torchlight (specifically 2, with co op) I have some affection for. I'm not a gigantor fan or anything. To me, the big difference is committing to character choices rather than just choosing each new skill as it comes along because you're on a linear path. You can end up somewhere interesting in D2. In D3, you can travel the path it has prescribed for you, then just choose from a menu at the end. I watched that Joseph Anderson video that someone mentioned in the comments here, and I had no idea the end game was exactly that min-maxy. I wonder how many people look up optimal builds versus come up with something on their own?
Duckfeed.tv
2019-03-03 20:09:32 +0000 UTCI would be curious to hear your opinion of the second game and/or Torchlight. I remember a period of time where people bemoaned how many games took after 2 instead of 1, and in my mind 2 was very much that grind-driven lootfest, so I never touched it. Is it just that 2's rough edges give it more character? Is the grind different in nature? I was so young when 1 came out that I just played it like a mouse-driven action game, and enjoyed it a lot; it's a real shame how far 3 has strayed from that.
Sid Menon
2019-03-03 19:36:21 +0000 UTCIt's just such a weird product if the idea is it's solely for people who bought it. Another casualty of lifestyle games, I guess.
Duckfeed.tv
2019-03-03 03:38:28 +0000 UTCYou made a "worn the stone to dust" reference towards the end and I think that's the most apt comparison. You're playing a game that has been worn down to what 97% of the remaining population wants. The game has stopped being for new players and more about keeping the faithful coming back each season. AFAIK the story mode hasn't really been given ANY attention at all aside from the expac adding a new act. Everything is about rifts and adventure mode now. Going through the story in 2019 is probably a terrible slog, you're leveling much slower and not really engaging with the systems that have gotten refinement in the last 2-3 years. It's probably a bummer for you to come in and see this version of Diablo sway away from what you liked, and as mentioned by others the game was much different at launch and also some of the systems you liked ARE there they're just locked behind gates you haven't unlocked yet and likely wouldn't for some time. This is also an interesting, to me anyway, look at what happens when you come to an evolving game so late. Sorry it turned out to be such a bummer! Still enjoyed the episode though even if i'm not aligned with your opinion. I like these brief stream of consciousness presents episodes.
David
2019-03-03 03:09:11 +0000 UTCInteresting thoughts! For my own experience, I was profoundly disappointed in the story and dialogue. It all felt like subpar fan fiction. Less would have really been more.
Brad Conlin
2019-03-03 01:55:06 +0000 UTCI kinda like this game once you get to the higher torments and greater rifts, but these are all valid complaints. Toying around with builds can be fun but it gets boring if you aren’t watching or listening to something else while playing. Getting higher tier loot and things you need for your build is super satisfying though, it feels more special than when leveling to 70. WoW is much worse because you have to play for ~200 hours to get to the content that is supposed to be “good” but still isn’t. There is also the added social aspect where you need to group up to clear higher level dungeons and raids, but the entire player base are gatekeepers that don’t welcome new players. Fully subscribe to the “git gud” school of thought. Having a play group helps but my experience was still very rocky even with a group of regulars. Sorry for the WoW tangent but I have mental damage from playing so much of it, though I’ve recently quit. Hopefully D4 is a major departure, Blizzard needs to do some soul searching.
Joelle
2019-03-02 09:08:06 +0000 UTCAmazing! I bought and played through the entirety of Diablo 3 (the main campaign I guess?) And was dumbfounded about the general acceptance this game has. Even the criticisms seemed to not be about the fatal flaws the thing has. It is deeply, tremendously boring. The things I like about and were glad of were problems which the game's own design raised. 'Keep the button pressed down until you can get a thing which allows you to lessen the time you have to press the button down so you can go further pressing the button down for longer.' I felt no tactical decisions, and the camera height and business meant I had little idea what my character was actually doing most of the time. And to look it up online and be met with: 'No, you have to play it for 30 more hours for it to get good' was absolutely beyond the pale.
Lewis Shaw
2019-03-02 07:48:45 +0000 UTCThanks for the info. In my defense, I can't really imagine playing a game that offers me a necromancer and not playing it, given my predilection for skulls and the like. Other than that, I've heard variations before about how much it opens up but that's really akin to adding a huge time tax onto a price tag. I don't have a set dollar amount for an hour of my time really, but even if I gave myself minimum wage, that turns Diablo 3 into the most expensive game I've ever played by quite a bit. That's a fatal blow, imo. -GB
Duckfeed.tv
2019-03-02 02:22:15 +0000 UTCAfter listening to this episode, a few things that I want to say in defense of the game: 1. Diablo III is a very different game today then it was at launch. One thing that keeps coming up in this podcast is that it's an incredibly streamlined overly easy game. While it was never difficult, the game was balanced very differently at launch. The difficulty modes were more similar to Diablo II, and loot was significantly less common. Around the time that the expansion launched, they released a second play modem "Adventure Mode", and rebalanced the difficulty. Adventure Mode is the game that the Diablo fans wanted-- it's designed around specific types of tasks including constantly scaling "Nephalem Rifts". 2. I don't have a specific counter to your argument "It shouldnt only get good in NG+" argument, because you're frankly right. It really sucks that Diablo III asks a new player to basically toil in a shit factory for god knows how long and basically recommends you play through the story mode. As you've noted, the story sucks, and it's not that much different to just be targeting bounties in the adventure mode, but you get to the interesting stuff a lot faster in adventure mode. And most of your complaints about meaningful gear and skills are very much completely turned on their head at maximum level. Which again, the fact that Diablo hides its light like this sucks. But there are very clearly defined builds and styles of play and combinations of items and skills that enable players to play meaningfully different builds (that can, of course, still be reduced to clicking). 3. You, through no fault of your own, chose the WORST character to play for the first time through. I am pretty positive that no one ever actually sat down and designed the necromancer with a first time player in mind. The leveling curve doesn't make a ton of sense, and the skills are placed haphazardly at best, and the necromancer is incredibly powerful at lower levels. The necromancer is also essentially the most recent content added to the game, and has spent it's entire life as a character designed around this max level game, rather than the game that was launched with a story in it. Also, I couldn't quite tell, but there is an option in the menus somewhere called elective mode. It's not obvious what it does, but it allows you to assign any one of your skills to any one of your hotkeys (with a couple of restrictions). While this doesn't replace the idea of building like you were looking for, it DOES allow a huge amount more permutations. Instead of making a choice between one of three summons, you could have all three, but not have as much utility. Or you could eschew ranged tools and summons entirely! I'm annoyed that this option isn't better surfaced, ESPECIALLY with blizzards tendency to prioritize UX. This won't make you suddenly like the game, but it might make it a little less painful.
Aaron Allen
2019-03-02 01:38:56 +0000 UTCDiablo 3 is a weird weird thing. It's a game that actively pushes away new players now (it wasn't at launch!) and is very focused on what it's small and engaged core community wants, big fucking numbers. Really big fucking numbers. It's a clicker, more or less. I like it because it's essentially asking a math problem. Given these ridiculous multipliers and these permutations of skills, how can you make your numbers as big as possible without instantly dying. Is it my favorite game? No. Is it something I'm constantly playing? Also no. Is it something I come back to once every few months and grind out a new seasonal build to figure out what ridiculously broken thing I can do now is? Absolutely.
Aaron Allen
2019-03-01 23:58:08 +0000 UTCI bought Diablo three to play with a buddy and I thought it was broken because I was underleveled or something. It turns out, no, the game just doesn't believe in challenge or story or anything.
Brian Perkins
2019-03-01 22:34:22 +0000 UTCI have thought about getting Diablo 3 about a million times. But I know, I know, that I will be bored with it within an hour. So I have managed to resist. Bring back Dark Alliance!
Bob Witz
2019-03-01 22:09:15 +0000 UTC
