The Expanse 4x06 Full Reaction
Added 2022-07-08 22:52:55 +0000 UTCthe edited one will be up tomorrow
Comments
James is just pointing out that Murtry, who consistently uses the "legal charter" as the basis for authority, is taking fascist actions that are incredibly illegal under that same system. Murtry's platform of legality is contradictory at best. Put with the rest of his actions, I think Amos hit something when he suggested he gets off on murder. He consistently escalates & aggravates tensions, in a desolate remote wasteland where teamwork is tantamount to survival. Murtry also consults no one in his killings of those he presumed guilty from context. He had evidence *someone* blew the pad, and some vocal militants to draw suspicion, but there's no sign he had evidence it was them, and he didn't bother to find out. He's a wannabe fascist, there's no two ways about it. I do agree Holden got a bit holier than thou in these episodes, highlighted by his surprise that Dr. Okoye, someone he finds reasonable, would be mad at him. I do agree with most, if not all, of his decisions, but I'm not fully behind his delivery. Seems to operate under the assumption that he already knows what's good, and rarely goes out of his way to solicit feedback.
Kevin McDonough
2022-07-10 19:03:08 +0000 UTCI did say in a previous post Murtry is going overboard, but I can't take anyone seriously who uses the term 'toxic masculinity' seriously, so that doesn't help.
Zyrus
2022-07-09 14:57:26 +0000 UTC100%. I completely agree with all of this.
Varun Laks
2022-07-09 13:55:52 +0000 UTCFor me, Murtry is one of those complex, layered characters of which I can still very easily say that they're in the wrong here. I do have some sympathy for him because the Belters did blow up his ship and he has justified anger for this (as well as probably some grief masking as anger under his toxic masculinity). And I also have a modicum of respect for him as a competent soldier even though he's much too much of an asshole to be a good overall leader, having basically no people skills. But in the end, he's just not a moral actor here. He's power-hungry and sadistic and he doesn't care about who is actually right or wrong, he just cares about his people and his tribalism, dismissing any and all claims by Belters as invalid simply because they're Belter and therefore, in his eyes, inherently untrustworthy. I think the show is very clever in giving us an actual reason to also condemn the Belters, and it not just being a paranoid fantasy by a racist, but it doesn't change the fact that Murtry still is a racist; he doesn't see the blowing-up of his ship as a reprehensible act by some Belters, but as a manifestation of the Belters' inherently reprehensible nature.
Christophe Schannes
2022-07-09 13:16:23 +0000 UTC"Furthermore, as Carol Chiwewe mentioned last episode, what does an Earth-made charter even mean to Belters? These are uncharted worlds, and Earth doesn’t have any galaxy-wide, or even system-wide, claim to them. The UN put the Illus charter together only after getting word that the Belters landed and created a colony in the first place. There is no reason the Illus Belters would, or even should, acknowledge it after being there for eight plus months." This should be pinned.
PongPong31
2022-07-09 11:06:38 +0000 UTCWell for me personally, considering I'm a lawyer (although not in Criminal Law), I'd probably try and go by the book here lol. Most of my comment was disputing the legal Charter argument. Like I said, I understand Murtry's anger towards the Belters involved in the shuttle attack. And to Murtry's credit, his anger hasn't really branched out to anyone further than the Belters directly involved. That being said, Murtry was clearly looking for any excuse to shoot Coop (or another Belter), as an example. He was basically baiting Coop in 402, and the dialogue suggests that at that point Murtry did not know they were involved in the shuttle attack. Until Murtry shot Coop, we have no reason to think that the other Belters were planning a second attack on the RCE either. I think its pretty clear that Murtry wanted the other Belters to retaliate, so that he could smoke them out and put them down in the act. So in my view, the "gun pointed in his general direction" doesn't really seem like a defense for Murtry, and instead seemed to have been something he specifically orchestrated. Either way, at no point would it have been particularly difficult for Murtry to simply subdue and "arrest" all the Belters involved, instead of shooting them. Even if the other innocent Belters had an issue with it, Holden would have taken Murtry's side at that point, because of the audio evidence showing that they were planning the attack. But Murtry wanted to kill them both as an example, and as Amos said because it "made his dick hard". I don't really think either reason is a justifiable defense for Murtry.
Varun Laks
2022-07-09 05:53:13 +0000 UTCWhen you have a gun pointed in your general direction, do you wait for some asshole months away to clean up the mess when they come for you the next day because you wanted to be by the book, or do you deal with the problem when they are clearly coming to kill you on wiretap?
Zyrus
2022-07-09 05:10:51 +0000 UTC(Continued) I always find it amusing to see reactors, commenters, and even friends of mine become just as tribal with this S4 storyline as the actual characters get. I gather from other comments you’ve made here, that you don’t particularly like the Belters, at least at this point of the story. While I disagree, I certainly think that’s a totally fair view point to have. I think it's a byproduct of the intentional writing choice to show an ugly side of both parties. The Expanse is generally fair to every side, and I think that's one of the most unique and best traits of the series. I do think Murtry’s anger is justified here, and personally I do think some reactors hate Murtry a bit too quickly without understanding his thought process. Still to say he has any legal standing in doing what he’s doing, is a bit much. Murtry is an agent of a privately owned company, and thus is subject to the standards of said company. Holden isn't saying anything that RCE, (and the UN in particular as the party who hired RCE), wouldn't also be saying if aware of the details of the situation.
Varun Laks
2022-07-09 04:58:42 +0000 UTCI honestly don’t think Holden has been “holier than thou ” whatsoever with Murtry, and on the contrary has actually been more than fair to him considering the circumstances. Holden came to the planet fully willing to work with the RCE and its charter, and only became hostile towards Murtry after he became Judge, Jury & Executioner. The charter doesn’t give anyone on the security team license to do anything close to what Murtry has been doing. This is something even Murtry knows, considering that he cut off communications so that people like Elvi couldn’t contact the company to have him recalled. Furthermore, as Carol Chiwewe mentioned last episode, what does an Earth-made charter even mean to Belters? These are uncharted worlds, and Earth doesn’t have any galaxy-wide, or even system-wide, claim to them. The UN put the Illus charter together only after getting word that the Belters landed and created a colony in the first place. There is no reason the Illus Belters would, or even should, acknowledge it after being there for eight plus months.
Varun Laks
2022-07-09 04:58:24 +0000 UTCI know most people won't like it, but I still love Murtry for not backing down from Holden's holier than thou crap. The man (James) wants to talk about the legal system, but refuses to acknowledge the legal claim there.
Zyrus
2022-07-09 02:44:54 +0000 UTCAnother great reaction . You should start giving MVP awards from now on on the end of every episode :) .Also writers of the books Daniel Abraham and Ty Franck who write under joint pen name as James S.A. Corry are also screen writers for the show and in later seasons they were producers as well . Probably one of the reasons why show is so good . Sure helps to have book writers in your writers room when you try to write the script .
Sone
2022-07-08 23:54:31 +0000 UTC
