Alice: Asylum - Narrative Outline - Crowd Design

So in Nicholas' eyes (see what I did there) the Vale of Tears has to do with sight (seeing what we don't normally see - we can't move forward if we don't "see" that we are stuck. This could tie into my idea for collecting another item BEFORE we get to Hatter - there are 2 eyes - why do they have to be collected together? Why not have us collect one and have that WTF moment then when Hatter explains his Champion idea it becomes clear that "hey we have 1 eye and we need the next" this would lead into Nicholas' Vale of Tears eye - also how does that fit thematically - well the Queen is in the realm of Anger and Judgement - how can we leave that state unless we "see" things for what they really are - we "see" our anger is destructive and getting us no where - we "see" that judging ourselves is pointless since what's done is done...this leads naturally into a person feeling depressed because they feel they are "getting no where...and all action is pointless" of course going through depression and getting out on the other side we learn that is not true and even more action is needed to progress

Question - hate to be the new "he write too many comments" person but... why is the brain linked to depression - Nicholas Brokaw had a great idea for the 3rd piece (the eye) linked to the vale of tears: : https://www.patreon.com/posts/45721434?utm_medium=clipboard_copy&utm_source=copy_to_clipboard&utm_campaign=postshare

It's me again - not sure if THIS is the place to put suggestions for story as I'm not familiar with how you are alerted when someone comments - anyways I thin the Hatter's realm and the Queens Throne room are too close together story-wise - this is going to be a slog getting through TWO exposition dumps back to back so to speak - I know you'll say but Mike Alice has to traverse the Hatter realm then get to him - ok but not sure how long of a gameplay that is - IF it is substantial may be fine but if not it will be roasted by the press for grinding the adventure to a halt with too much dialog and not enough action - A suggestion - what if the Queen says the Hatter has a task for her but won't let her talk to him until she's got one of the champion's items (the queen doesn't even need to tell Alice what the thing is - just get "X" from "Y" and once you have it the Hatter will open the way to his place. The Hatter can then say "ah you found it you found it you found it..one of the pieces that is missing" then explain then tell her to go get the other pieces.

Thanks for the compliment. It means a lot coming from a great creative mind like you. I am super excited to read your next draft.

Just a note to say thanks for posting this. I was re-reading these comments this morning while writing more in these scenes. And the stuff you've shared here is great.

American McGee

Just a note to say thanks for posting this. I was re-reading these comments this morning while writing more in these scenes. And the stuff you've shared here is great.

American McGee

Another thing I was thinking about (I hope all these comments aren't wasted because no one will read them..) is what if at the Hatter's place where the Cheshire Cat helps Alice we have him change to a kitten (then we could have both Cat and Kitten in this game) - I was thinking he could say something like "I know I'm harsh but I can be as gentle as a kitten when I want to be". Then throughout the rest of the game Alice could tease him about his new form (the helpful Cheshire Kitten)

There are a few things I posted in Discord but since I’m a bit late for some of this talk I’ll post the cliff notes here: 1) When the Circus has the singing part - what if running speeds the tempo just a bit, jumping and gliding slows it down a bit and running backwards through the level (or the wrong way) makes the song do that backwards evil sound that records make (even make a “Paul is dead” moment where it sounds like it's saying “this is the wrong way” - creepy and fun. 2) The train could be the way through the levels with the “hall of doors” the fast travel to previous levels. I’m thinking more of a Tower of Memories (as illustrated in the ANGER/JUDGEMENT REALM - THRONE ROOM part. 3) What if - each time you travel by train the camera shows the level in a pan of the scene and ends with the camera looking at the train (and focusing in on the doors and that's when it transitions to Alice playing) - BUT when it pans over the train the camera will show a Tower of Memories floating near the train station with a walkway to it (each Tower would be the exact same in form but be a different color to make the level/stage).

I know I’m extremely late on this post but I’m new and wasn’t a Patron when this came out: 1) Alice running away to the house - how about we have the camera peer through a snow globe and see Alice in the snow (maybe don’t call it slumber by the way because that is when she see the caterpillar and those are two separate parts) 2) What if when she is in the house and family on fire she sees another snow globe and that transitions to the caterpillar. 3) Perhaps in the caterpillar section Shadow Alice is really big peering into the globe and then Shadow Alice breaks the glass and that is where the shard/crystal knife comes from. I think Shadow Alice’s voice should be garbled but we definitely should hear her say “...run...away… to… the...circus..Alice” This will confuse child Alice and the player into thinking that Shadow Alice is an Enemy but in fact the way out is through. 4) I don’t think having Shadow Alice as a creature fits. Maybe it's the Alice we know but darker and more smoky. Also instead of screaming when defeated maybe jumbled words. 5) Another point on Shadow Alice - maybe each time we are about to face a big boss (example the Tweedles), Shadow Alice comes first talking in backwards talk or jumbled talk. There is a reason for this thought. In the end we can play the game again and hear it was Adult Alice trying to help Child Alice - by preparing her for a new fight and giving encouragement - but she can’t fully break through (thus we “fight” her along the journey only to realize she was helping). This sort of mini boss tutorial has been done in games like Chrono Cross. 6) Another reason for the Shadow Alice/mini boss/tutorial piece is from the artwork of Omri. There are some dresses that Martin and American don’t like - make them the Shadow Alice dresses (I’m thinking of the Clown faced one and the business suit one - both are great but not for Alice - perhaps a shadowy version makes more sense). 7) Yet another reason for the different outfits for Shadow Alice is replay-ability. Imagine unlocking all those outfits to be able to play a second or third playthrough with them. 8) Other thoughts are every time we met Caterpillar we see a snow globe in the level -so getting near or “passed” that section triggers the interaction - examples are a snow globe on the fireplace at the burning house, a snow globe on a table full of toys and prizes in the circus, and maybe the gavel at the judgement portion is actually a snow globe. 9) Back to the burning house Alice continually runs from - when Alice get to the balloon to confront the moon she should see below that the whole thing is on an island (back of a turtle) BUT also see there are burning houses (like 5 or 6) ringing the circus as if the Queen knew that Alice would run so every direction was thwarted.

CROWD DESIGN section: I’m probably most interested in Londerland or the Funeral Scene/World. Londerland just seems like a neat idea to explore. I’d probably tie it into finding the eyes because she’d be exploring some more repressed (or unknown) memories. So metaphorically she’s opening her eyes. Then the Funeral Scene/World definitely needs to be expanded on and it’s something that neither of the previous Alice games touched on. And speaking of touch, I’d probably tie this one with finding the skin. Maybe connect it to when the babies skin touched the water? On page 8, a gameplay idea could be battle sequences that shape the landscape of Wonderland. Notes for Fire Alice: Could she be the representation of her thoughts of wishing she’d died in the fire with her family? Which could be why she wants to make our Alice’s life a living hell. On page 15 (for me) you say “Fire Alice is consumed in a flash of flames…” Does this mean she was defeated or that she teleported away? Is Fire Alice the reason the Queen and everyone thinks Alice is spreading chaos? Thus, making Fire Alice turning our Alice’s rabbit into a chaos creature, and then disappearing before the Queen shows up, a great way for her to screw over Alice. Also just pointing out that her age between the text and image is different. (SPOILERS for 3rd Act) Ideas for 3rd Act: A tense scene where the white chess pieces tell Alice that she’s been wasting her time focusing on the wrong (short) game. They hint that the champion isn’t what it’s made out to be. I kind of like the idea of the Chaos being uncontrollable and having that be the message by the end (then Alice would learn to accept and control it). But the Queen turning on her could be a good message too. Like focusing too hard on controlling chaos can leave you open for betrayal. I also have entire scenes written out of Adult Alice and Asylum Alice meeting up and it’s a lot more existential than just “beating the bad guy.” I’ll save it until we get to there in Crowd Design, but I can’t wait. Just curious, does Hatter know about the Queen’s betrayal? Also, you bring up Shadow Alice at the very end. I know we’ve talked about her in the past, but I didn’t see her mentioned even once in the Outline except at the end. Are you still planning to have her sprinkled throughout? And is she somehow linked to Fire Alice from the dungeons? (After reading the comments you can negate most of this comment) General Notes/Ideas: Map/Level Intro Cutscenes that include swooping vista shots and animated title cards. (Think Kingdom Hearts) Intro to the Queen’s Domain could be the classic close-up camera following a cute critter to its doom. General Concept/Theme Idea that ties into gameplay – Alice tries to stomp out the chaos by clearing out chaos (cores?) and establishing bases/checkpoints/campsites throughout the different sections of Wonderland. But by the end the chaos takes back all the areas that Alice worked so hard to cleanse. This could push Alice over the edge to do something brash. (Like stand up to Shadow Alice) After reading all the comments, I also agree with a lot of what Lucky Dragon brings up.

I have a wrinkle to this that might be cool. Perhaps we could reevaluate the idea that Shadow Alice is in fact Adult Alice. That is as she is choosing to appear in Wonderland at the moment, and she is actively trying to stop her better nature from saving herself because the pain is too much to bear.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

I don't know, it kinda sounds like we need a Robo-Bumby now (was he the one rebuilt into 3PPO?) As for reconstruction of the self its quite nice to see "solve et coagula" arise again after what feels like a long absence from my mind. The psychological underpinnings are quite fascinating and there's definitely potential to mine with Alice (young, adult, and/or Shadow) being the author of some of her own misfortune...and of her evolution.

That is what we're ultimately working towards, Greg: The enemy is the self - though "enemy" isn't exactly the right word. More like the "obstacle" is the self. And specifically, the Old Self. The Old Self has to be transformed in order to properly integrate the Confrontation with Chaos. Integration also means acceptance of the Light and Dark (Child and Adult) aspects of the personality. It's a re-shaping of a person's basic structures. You can't undo the Confrontation with Chaos (in Alice's case, The Fire and the destruction of her family); you can only reshape yourself to fit within the new reality. The Old You will just suffer endlessly if forced to continue to exist as-was in the new reality. And don't worry, we're not doing the Bumby thing... but I thought it was interesting to reveal that the creative process can take you to places like that. And there are plenty of examples of stories that are written in that way - stories that ultimately disappoint because they remove focus from the hero and the hero's struggle. The Queen (in combo with The Jabberwock) will open the door to escape the Snowglobe Reality (probably destroying it in the process) - which means they can flee (along with Young Alice) into the larger/real Wonderland... a place where they have access to Adult Alice's psyche. This is where they could do real damage ... but ... the real Prime Mover will be revealed at this point and they'll be removed from the board. So... who would endeavor to construct all that... so that Young Alice can be freed from the Snowglobe? I feel like there's an opportunity here to craft something along the lines of "It was Young Alice all along" but because of her memory being constant wiped (by The Moon) she didn't realize until the plan was complete that she'd been the one putting the pieces in place all along. Hmmm...

American McGee

Thanks for the reply, does clarify some of the questions I had. As remarkable a villain as Bumby was I don't know if I'd like to see him return as the man-behind-the-curtain again, probably best to leave him splattered across the train tracks. Perhaps if the Queen went with the Jabberwock to fight the "root" of the chaos in the Chess Realm, only to get consumed by it and become all tentacle-y at that point and suddenly realize: she wasn't the one jailing Alice, it was Alice jailing her in this globe all along. Then there's a boss fight that removes the Queen from the game and leaves Alice with a new opponent: herself.

Yeah so Child Alice has two goals in my mind. Trying to save Adult Alice, but then the Queen distracts her by stealing her rabbit and takes her off the path she’s supposed to be on. That actually makes the Queen holding the rabbit hostage an even smarter move, because she’s taking Child Alice’s eyes off the ball.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Oh and the most crucial thing you said that I completely agree with is Child Alice being aware of her position in Adult Alice’s psyche. That gives her a clear motivation beyond just trying to save her rabbit. Which I’m not saying that aspect needs to be removed. I think Child Alice can both be trying to save her self and also be motivated by a selfish need to hold on to her rabbit. That reminds me of one thing I forgot to say about that. I actually think it would be great if Adult Alice does indeed give her rabbit away to a child she meets, and that Child Alice never really gets it back. I think it could be a poignant message that the reason Child Alice clings to her rabbit is it represents all her happy memories and Adult Alice can assure her in the end that she doesn’t need the rabbit to have those memories. Nobody can take her memories from her.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

And like I said that’s a knee jerk reaction. I’m sure there’s a way to even do a Bumby revival that could be successful. But I know that it’s just ideas floating around. Half of my ideas are absolutely absurd myself, but they lead me to pretty okay ideas and maybe even some kinda good ones. You know from experience that my ideas can range pretty wildly from atrocious to alright. 😂

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

You know the thing I was actually most curious about your opinion of was the Mega Snark 😅

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

About Cheshire, I’m behind saving him for later. That’s a bold move holding back a popular character like that. I was just thinking it would weird if he has a mechanical function in the game that would we wouldn’t have access to in the first half. But then again his hints are mostly dressing and not at all practical so I guess it wouldn’t matter much.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Yeah, I don't know yet... like I said, brainstorming. It would certainly make more sense for her to continue to suffer trauma even after he's gone. He was messing around inside her head. Who knows what sort of poison he left in there? But... any sort of "external" threat... I feel we did that already. This last part of the story is really meant to be about Alice, by herself, going through the final stages of healing. To introduce a new external threat - or even revive Bumby as a mental ghost threat - would diminish that a bit. Again: Brainstormng!

American McGee

Perhaps it’s not that Bumby is actually alive, but he in some way is still haunting her, like he is the origin of her PTSD. Maybe we can explore the idea that killing her tormentor did not rid her of the torment. And perhaps even though he was a supremely evil bastard that deserved to die, maybe Alice is holding on to guilt about actually killing a human being. That I would be 100% behind.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

We do need to tighten up the connection to Adult Alice... I am still struggling with the exact mechanic where we present that connection. And how early in the story do we show Young Alice that she's contained within her Adult Self? In response to your comment on this, I've been thinking about these things a lot lately. I do not have a solution yet... but it does need to be solved. I think it's likely to be better if we just come right out and make it clear early on that Young Alice is aware of her position within the psyche of Adult Alice. It makes her mission clearer and also avoids the "it was all a dream/simulation" disappointment that might come with a later reveal. Yes, the story as presented is Linear. But once we create a bunch of the chunks related to her Quests - then we will make it so those can be completed in a variety of orders. And we'll layer in some side-quests and other elements to break up the Linear feel of the thing... though... it will still be a 90% Linear game experience. Just a question of how we dress it up not to feel like that. All that being said, when we write this stuff down on paper... I mean, that's kinda how sentences and things work. Linear. Cheshire Cat... I kinda like holding him back as a surprise for later in the game. Fight me. Yes, lots of stages or areas go into Depression. Because Depression is the container for all the shit you go through when you are dealing with PTSD. It's where you end up... in a state of near-constant depression waiting for the next trigger to send you into a brief bout of anger, sadness, guilt, doubt, suicidal thoughts, false happiness, etc. But you always come back to Depression because you're trapped. That is why the bulk of the game takes place inside the container we call Depression. And... let's not get too literal about these containers, yeah? Boss Battles will be a thing in order to capture the Peices. Boss Battles are relatively easy... so I don't think we're going to struggle with this. Just need to come up with the character or characters who represent the Boss for that area. And, yes, Shadow Alice needs to get layered into the story in more places. She is critical ... and I have it in my mind that she is always there... but I wasn't doing much work to reference her in these large story beats. I can make more mention of her - and the Adult Alice stuff - so that becomes more clear. What if Shadow Alice wasn't the ultimate Bad Guy? I wrote in a note to Greg that Alice's suicidal thoughts could be a function of Bumby still being alive and manipulating Alice through subtle cues and hints. Perhaps only the subconscious is aware of this? And so it's the Shadow that seeks to release the Child so that they can join together and save the Adult? Don't get too bent out of shape around that line of thinking... I am just brainstorming and have had a ton of such thoughts as I've poked around trying to resolve some of the questions generated by these comments. Great stuff!

American McGee

To that last possibility you floated, gotta say my knee jerk reaction to that idea is that I definitely don’t like it. Taking away Alice’s triumph and undoing all of what she accomplished doesn’t sit right with me. We’d be treading the same exact ground as AMR. It would kind of invalidate AMR too if Bumby didn’t die. Please don’t pull a Rise of Skywalker on us.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Greg, all good comments. And I've been thinking about how to address certain elements... First, yeah, it's not surprising that it feels "good" at the start and then sort of tapers off. Lots of detail still to fill in on the later stages. We'll get there. We do need a "central quest" - or a series of quests or goals. Otherwise we'll feel the movement through the game is aimless. My sense of the lineup between Grief and The Pieces and Alice's Journey... a lot of these things can be explained but I've never wanted to come straight out and say (during the game) that "this level represents this aspect of Alice's psyche" - or "this character represents this aspect of Alice's trauma" ... we usually don't spell it out like that. That being said, the symbology is there - eye, heart, brain - all things needed to overcome an encounter with Trauma. As for "agency" - man, this is always a tricky one! Hero characters aren't always charging out in front of everyone and making all the decisions. Sometimes they end up being co-opted by other characters. The important part (for me in this situation) is that Alice agrees to the tasks because shes been told this is how she'll recover her Rabbit, save Wonderland, and go back home. Now... I have been thinking, we could have Alice KILL The Queen in that scene where she's being told what needs to be done... she would then reveal (earlier) that The Queen was in fact a Manipulator. And she could then head off to see Hatter under her own power... but even Hatter is going to have to tell her that certain steps must be taken in order to accomplish her goals. She doesn't just come out of Denial knowing what must be done. If The Queen or Hatter or someone doesn't explain it to her... how does she know? As for Alice "seeing a mile away" the Queen's double-cross... I don't intend for that to be the end of that arc. The Queen herself will be double-crossed. And the ultimate manipulator - the character making sure that all these things happen - is an aspect of Alice... she's guiding her young self through all of this in order to save herself. So... Alice isn't the one that gets double-crossed... it's The Queen. But we need to flesh that out a bit more. For "linear" - yeah, the bulk of it needs to be written in a linear fashion. We will add on some branches and side stories later. First, need to make sure we're happy with the large structure that holds everything together. Thank you, for your comments... you did get me really thinking about some crazy ways in which we might ensure it feels like Alice has agency (killing the Queen early) and also thinking on the topic of the Big Twist at the end... Jeeze, for a moment there, I was even thinking that our ultimate Puppet Master, the character secretly manipulating Adult Alice into wanting to kill herself... the one pulling the strings in the real world... might even be Bumby. Who says that train killed him?! Woo... woo...

American McGee

Thanks for the notes and ideas, Patrick. A couple of things really stand out to me: I like the idea of an impending Flood as a concept within the Undersea / Underwater Realm. A flooding and flooded London would be really interesting visually and as a metaphor for the destruction of this "leaf" of Wonderland. The Basement stuff is good. Need to think about how to present that... the way it was done in AMR was excellent. How to take that one step further? Ah! The idea of the Chaos Flowing into Wonderland through the Church is EXCELLENT. I had touched on this previously... a looong time ago... that Alice would need to make her way *down* to the bottom of the Snow Globe in order to find where the Chaos was seeping in. Hinting at The Church through a couple of different scenes/memories could help to build up towards the discovery of that location as the "source." Could work! Thank you, for presenting your ideas. I'll keep them in mind.

American McGee

So I love the bones of this story so far. I think this is a very strong foundation. And while I’m supposed to be focused on the second act, I have some constructive notes on what leads up to it. I’ll try to keep this as brief and concise as possible, but I’m gonna fail miserably. Sorry 😅 Narratively, what seems to be missing for me is the connection to Adult Alice. I feel like there’s a lot to explore there, and that she should be more present in the story. Rather than learn what’s going on topside with Adult Alice towards the end of the game, it would be nice and help give perspective to the player to see what’s going on in the “real world”. What’s the external cause of all this tumult? My suggestion is at each Caterpillar scene we transition to Adult Alice in sequences that function very much the same as the London sequences in AMR. These do not have to be long sequences, but it would go a long way to periodically remind the player of the real world stakes and why all this is happening in the first place. And we can delve into Alice’s life and better understand what is driving her to make the decision she is contemplating Mechanically, I must agree there is a linearity, that while it may have worked 11 or so years ago, with such a dense narrative, it does highlight the repetition of the gameplay loop and actually makes the gameplay feel like busy work just to get from cutscene to cutscene. If it behaves like a movie with gameplay interspersed throughout, people will eventually just want it to be a movie minus the gameplay which we don’t want. Furthering the story should feel like an accomplishment rather than a guided tour. But there is a simple solution to this. You don’t have sacrifice linear level design, but by giving the player the freedom to pause the story and return to previous levels to achieve objectives that may or may not be needed to advance, the player will be more engaged with the gameplay and will return to the story when they feel like they have adequately bolstered their abilities. So all that need be done is introduce the fast travel mechanic at the earliest possible opportunity, probably after the first stage is completed. Keep the linear level design to keep the through line of the story, but with freedom to return to old stages. This would be very much Jedi Fallen order or other Soulslike games, with Metroidvanianess of being able to access certain areas that you may have not prior had the ability to. Why do I bring this up in a narrative discussion? Because it will need to be written into the narrative, some excuse for why Alice could and should want to revisit previous areas, and gameplay incentives for doing so as well. Then I have a selection of minor points in no particular order. If Cheshire as a hint giver is returning as a mechanic, he needs to be introduced earlier, like the very first level. That would be an odd feature to gain access to halfway through the game. This is a really minor point, but since the Mock Turtle is so prominent in the Denial Realm portion of the game, it might be confusing for non Insane Children if Alice meets another Mock Turtle later on, especially if she doesn’t address it. WE know that the other Mock Turtle was an imposter, but it might be cleaner if you replace Mock Turtle’s role in the Vale of Tears will a character like Bill McGill. On the realms, multiple realms are standing in for Depression at present, and I really feel like each stage of grief should be confined to one stage or chapter. Vale of Tears works as Depression, I’ve already said the Londerland stage could be the concept of Repression, and the Chess Realm can be called Acceptance. Maybe that last one is a stretch symbolically, but that is where everything seems to go down and where the endgame happens or at least initiates. And finally, there seems to be a lack of bosses, specifically in the Bargaining Realm and the Vale of Tears/ Depression Realm. At the end of many of these stages Alice just seems to receive the champion piece just by reaching the end of the stage or completing a puzzle. A fight with a boss should definitely always precede her acquiring those. In that vein, I think you could use those boss opportunities to have encounters with Shadow Alice. She’s alluded to at the beginning and presently not brought back into the story until the end. I personally believe that you should be seeding the idea that Shadow Alice is very important and multiple encounters could help to do that. We’ve already talked about how Fire Alice and Shadow Alice should in my opinion be consolidated. All that needs adjusted to make that work is have Shadow Alive revert to her base form after being defeated. But a couple other places I can think of where you could have another Shadow Alice boss battles is the Vale of Tears where she can take on the properties of water, (and maybe also have the ability to stop time) and perhaps since as Fire Alice she took the form of a small child alice, maybe this watery Shadow Alice can be a bit Lizzieish, like the vision Alice may of had of herself to want to grow up to be just like Lizzie? And the penultimate Shadow Alice battle could be her riding atop the great big Snark in Repression. She’s actually the one wielding the repressed memories and trying to trap Child Alice in them. And of course there would be the final battle but I’ve took enough of your time making you read all this nonsense of mine. Again very sorry

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

I’m so sorry for what I’m about to do. 😅 But this is important right? If there’s one thing I struggle with, it’s brevity. But you know this.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Btw you don’t have to call it the Mega Snark. I just mean it’s a really big snark. You could call it a Giant Snark or Colossal Snark.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

So let me address the 2nd act stuff first. I do think it should be an all encompassing Londerland world including all those elements. A Wonderlandy London, an asylum, A funeral, A graveyard, A burning house, A giant flooded basement, all of that and one leading to the other. It should all still be very surreal though. We should never not be aware that Alice is still in Wonderland. At the very bottom of the of the basement Alice can fight her repressed memories in the form of a boss. Maybe a Mega Snark? And perhaps as the battle progresses, the Mega Snark transports Child Alice to memories she’s yet to experience, like the battle moves to a blown out Village of the Doomed from the first game for instance. I also think it would be cool that someone is riding the Mega Snark, but I will address that in my forthcoming comment. And repression is what I believe this area should be about. It’s not really a stage of grief, but it can certainly hinder the process. And the Mad Hatter can explain to her that before Alice can move any further she needs to address these repressed memories or she won’t be strong enough. So call this the Repression Realm. It will act as the penultimate stage.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Tough as its been for me, I’ve tried to abbreviate my comments as much as possible. Despite the somewhat critical tone, I do think that overall this initial outline is in a very solid place in terms of story and presentation. The knee-jerk reaction while reading was that the story starts off strong and gets weaker as it moves along, though that is more than likely the result of the first act being the most fleshed out and as acts 2 and 3 get the same treatment this sensation will be addressed. However if there’s one part that doesn’t “fit” for me at the moment, its the quest for the Champion Pieces. Its presentation feels at odds with the narrative’s central conceit of going through the stages of grief. On a character level, having Alice be the Queen’s errand-girl robs her of her agency, she becomes reactive rather than proactive in her own story. On a story level, it grinds the forward progression to a halt with what feels like a massive sidequest. On a symbolic level, I don’t see how this really lines up with Bargaining and Depression. And lastly I wonder if the average player will think Alice is an idiot for not seeing the Queen’s double-cross coming from a million miles away? Perhaps I’m missing something or just not getting it but this seems “off” in its current iteration. Other than that, as a general gameplay question is the game now a more strictly “linear” journey? Has the idea of a central hub between missions and the ability to revisit older locations with new abilities been changed to a mission flow more like “AMA” and “AMR”?

American this is excellent. I read Act 1 and 2. I did not read Act 3 Bc I didn’t want to be spoiled too much😁. Looks awesome so far. I love the detail! Here’s my ideas too https://docs.google.com/file/d/1dKWLqvE7qphmC-1yHCTJEPUZi527-4H9/edit?usp=docslist_api&filetype=msword

"The other thing I worry about - because it's happened to me with previous stories - is losing my drive to finish writing. That's already a tricky beast to manage - as anyone who writes for a living will tell you. And I know from other writers I've talked to that sharing work mid-stream is notorious for creating a loss in the drive to finish the thing... Let's hope that doesn't happen!" I understand what you mean. Double-edged sword, huh? You might get some useful feedback as a result, but there's a risk of dousing the flames. I will take a look at it and tell you what I think!

Thanks for the ongoing support, Greg. Look forward to discussing the story with you and the other Insane (Writer) Children in detail.

American McGee

Thank you for sharing this outline! I sympathize with those crawling heebie-jeebies one gets when sharing unfinished work for critical examination and applaud the decision to go through with all the same. Seeing "crowd design" go all the way to the very narrative reminds me why I feel so confident and rewarded in supporting this Patreon and your creative endeavors. As for the outline itself...I've already given it a first read-through and will take some time to ruminate, ponder, and perhaps even contemplate before returning with my big chunks of feedback and commentary.

I will keep an eye on the comments coming in ... for several days? A week? You can always sent a note to Font Lord (Patreon Messages) to remind if an important comment is made.

American McGee

Hooray! This is so exciting! How long do you plan to monitor this post for ideas? I might need a bit of time to think (and read) through this before I can get anything superb to you.

Nicholas Brokaw

Chess Realm is still a place. She goes there twice (at least).

American McGee

Quick question after giving this a skim, is the Chess Realm no longer going to be a level and is now just the stage for the Queen/Jabberwock boss?

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’

Very intrigued by this.

Death of Ink

You? You'll have plenty to say? No way! :P

American McGee

This will obviously take some time to digest. I won’t return with feedback until tomorrow probably. But you know me, I’ll have plenty to say I’m sure. Looking forward to giving this a good long read.

Lucky Dragon ‘She.They’