Hidden True Crime - BEHIND THE SCENES: Debra and Chris Sterns Interview

Late. But I'm flummoxed as to how people didn't understand where y'all were coming from. I don't get the confusion. Seems straightforward.😕 Professor Matthias📚 is trained in this, not just asking random questions? But he's a teacher, so of course he explained😅 I think it was a needed interview & Laurens good at those🎤💜🎚️

Vickie Teachey-Thomas

2025-05-11 22:53:44 +0000 UTC

I feel so sorry for this mother and father, it’s really sad, but I’m afraid Maddie is not getting full justice.

cameron jones

2025-04-12 07:14:28 +0000 UTC

I agree with so much of what you said! I think you’re spot on with a lot of the issues you called up in the parenting styles and the impacts they had on Stephan growing up. In addition, I caught a couple things that the parents said that really made me think he may have been on the spectrum but not diagnosed and therefore not supported (especially given the other items you mention!) his super focus in only things he was interested in, running around the house on his toes, not really forming close friendships… having parents that seem very focused on a self image of perfection and needing you to fit in that too while you likely don’t really understand social norms and will struggle extra with that, couldn’t have helped him grow healthy attachment styles…

Celia Polman

2025-02-08 05:17:45 +0000 UTC

Curious about their response that neither of their parenting contributed to his dysfunctional behaviour ….I’ve made loads of mistakes as a parent- interesting they don’t Dad had long affair when SS was young, mother allegedly paid off friend for SS secret pics of female room mate

Emma Howden

2024-11-28 07:13:03 +0000 UTC

Maybe you should try it ….you ain’t 20 no more

Emma Howden

2024-11-28 06:53:39 +0000 UTC

WNTTAK is one of my favourite books :)

Frankie van Rooyen

2024-11-18 01:16:19 +0000 UTC

The only known interview of Randall Woodfield The I5 Killer is when his father visited him in jail. When he left he said “that’s not my son”. What I would give to hear from the family. what they think for that reason this interview is priceless and will be important for a very long time. Good job getting it no matter what they had to say.

Trial Junkie

2024-11-15 21:13:23 +0000 UTC

A gun plus children really- barely out of 6th grade- they didn't know what might happen or what to do

Interestedparty1

2024-11-12 22:27:33 +0000 UTC

Parents aren’t as responsible as everyone thinks. The Sterns aren’t gang members or ex-cons. More information is always better. I still feel Jen holds a lot of responsibility. But she’s probably just deeply naive and damaged herself. I don’t understand the sympathy/empathy for perpetrators sentenced to death. The victim’s parents never get to see their kids ever, ever again. Life without is fine. Explanations don’t make excuses imo. The danger of him being released is a more important problem.

Kirsten C

2024-11-05 01:53:45 +0000 UTC

Just joined, currently binging backwards. I still think pedophiles deserve much, much longer sentences. But that’s a whole different discussion 🥰

Kirsten C

2024-11-05 01:21:15 +0000 UTC

I want to send my appreciation to you both for your work. Especially helping with the understanding of the complexities of the human condition and challenging the narratives and assumptions of what "a perpetrator" is. As a victim of childhood abuse by my family, I can speak first hand to the fact that an abusive/toxic relationship can exist, but what is shown to the world is very different. It is highly complex and there is so much more nuance to the finer understanding of how these abuses can perpetuate "under your nose". People seem to want to pigeon hole exactly what a perpetrator is, but that also leads to views and perspectives of what a "perfect victim" is - which is equally problematic. So I thank you for the way you are bringing these nuances to light.

Dani Brook

2024-10-20 22:10:05 +0000 UTC

I joined your patron just for this, I have never joined patron for anyone else. The psychology of crime fascinates me. I feel like them acknowledging that Stephan was the sole perpetrator didn't fully come across so I appreciate this behind the scenes.

E Vega

2024-10-16 05:59:21 +0000 UTC

Thank you for the interview and sharing your thoughts afterwards. I do think his parents separation affected him, the secrets they’ve kept from him. However, he had a choice and chose wrong. He deserves whatever he’s getting.

Puck Grader

2024-10-06 16:50:05 +0000 UTC

This is yet another example of why I chose to financially support THIS podcast. It is so helpful to understand what Dr. John does in his day job. I learn so much from you two. Thank you for all you do, the professionalism you show, and the empathy you have for everyone.

Drkatiedds

2024-10-05 07:35:09 +0000 UTC

Thank you so much for conducting this interview! I absolutely appreciate being able to to hear this rare perspective. I found it an interesting task for myself to really listen to them and hear the information while keeping my own emotions in check and really listen to John's approach in challenging the narrative. Specifically the topic of empathy and understanding what that might look like in a perpetrator, in this case SS. It really is about challenging that desire for me to put things in a neat little box so I can avoid that fear and make sense of it. I want to believe that I would know if a SS came into my life I would recognize him for what he is immediately, but is that reality? Seeing the humaness of SS parents trying to come to terms with all of this is real and it's messy and it's hard. This interview and your thoughts has really got me thinking. My love for my child is absolutely unconditional. Honestly, which would be more difficult? To find out my child is a victim or to find out my child is the perpetrator in any horrible criminal scenario? None of us lives day to day thinking this could happen to us.🤷‍♀️

catherine mcallister

2024-10-05 06:27:25 +0000 UTC

Super excited about that philosophical show you're putting together! The psychology and philosophy that Dr John gives in these episodes is definitely something I value about your content! It's very intriguing, and I'm here for it!

Ausha Bock

2024-10-05 04:11:40 +0000 UTC

Huh?

Emily M.

2024-10-03 17:26:28 +0000 UTC

More important is your over-doing lip injections, and literally frying your facial skin…watch out for skin cancer.

Ronald Helm

2024-10-03 17:23:25 +0000 UTC

So many questions. You add different angle. It’s so confusing. I do hope, as you do, we are able to get more understanding. It may come at trial as more conversations take place and more evidence is brought to 💡 light.

Terrie

2024-10-02 09:51:58 +0000 UTC

I would really hope to hear Dr John's take on the Carly Gregg's case and would love to hear an interview with her step dad whose stood by her even after she killed her mom and tried to kill him. How does a 14 yr old who made a 30 on her ACT at the age of 13 do this. Even with a possible bi polar diagnosis

TexasTCMom

2024-10-01 16:48:26 +0000 UTC

I am very interested in whether they can find Stephan’s other child victims. There are always other victims.

Catherine Hargrave

2024-10-01 15:00:52 +0000 UTC

I joined patreon to watch this specific video.

Nicole Champeau

2024-10-01 02:32:27 +0000 UTC

It also reminds me of Lori's sister. Summer. People have been really upset that she stays a bit supportive of Lori

Denise Walsh

2024-09-30 17:15:53 +0000 UTC

I feel like there were some jail calls that the mom had with Stefan, it sounded like she was blaming Jen and his family. I'd love to hear her thought process around all of that...

Denise Walsh

2024-09-30 17:14:29 +0000 UTC

I'm a clinical psychologist and I am so curious about why people do what they do. So understanding Stephanie is a part of getting into the mind of the perpetrator. I thought the interview with the parents was fascinating. It seems as though they are still trying to figure out how this happened as well, but as they look back I bet they'll be able to spot red flags

Denise Walsh

2024-09-30 16:35:55 +0000 UTC

Mom said he had a core 4 or 5 group of friends; yet, they said there lots of kids going in and out all the time… contradictory???

Martha Alexander

2024-09-30 15:06:10 +0000 UTC

I don’t think the world understands unconditional love because Unconditional love can only come from God because he loves us unconditionally We think we’re good people because we don’t murder and rape people, but we hate people in our heart and God says that hatred is the same as murder so there’s that.

Susan

2024-09-30 12:41:00 +0000 UTC

You are so sweet, Hope. Ty. I’m truly blessed and appreciate your prayers. Blessings and peace to you🕊️

Terrie

2024-09-30 09:15:37 +0000 UTC

I love this follow-up to the Sterns interview. Also love the informal conversational style of it, which reminds me of your early podcasts “at your dinner table.” First, I have watched, heard and read a lot of true crime content. I was trying to think if I had ever heard parents acknowledge that they know their child did this terrible thing, and while I think there might be one or two, it’s rare. So I have a lot of respect for Stephan’s parents, for recognizing that and saying it, and for turning over the computer and other items to the police. I feel like their interview touched some of the most fundamental questions about parenting. I especially loved you two talking in this recording about unconditional love, specifically “is your love for your child unconditional?” I think it might depend at least partially on what “love” means to you. I will never forget an episode of Dateline that I saw years ago, where a father says to his son, “I’m not going to abandon you, Cody—not at all—but you have to start to tell the truth and do what you can to make things right for Michaela (the victim).” It had such an impact on me, and I admired this father so much because so many parents seem to continue forever in denial and even continue to enable their child after they’ve done something monstrous. We have three adult sons and all of them are good people. Some people say you are lucky if your children turn out well. Others will say they turn out well because of good parenting. We say that we feel fortunate. It’s not luck— we worked really hard. Neither of us has ever worked so hard at anything as we have at being good parents. But we know some families where it seems the parents did the right things and the children didn’t necessarily grow up to reflect that. The truth is, you don’t really know. In a recent conversation about this with my youngest son (22 years old) he said he thought most of it was how we raised them. I asked him “What did we do that was so right?” He said “I think one of the biggest things was that you didn’t give us room to feel even one whiff of entitlement.” I thought this was interesting, and I was glad to hear it, but the truth is that you don’t know for sure. And all your children are different. I so appreciated your further discussion in this episode around the mention of “empathy” in the Sterns interview that seems to have been controversial. I believe that child predators have a sort of empathy, which is the thing that allows them to get close to victims. Someone wrote in the comments that if we believe the only people who are dangerous to our children are people who appear dangerous or threatening, our children are in a lot more danger, and I have always agreed with that. With regard to the question of how someone who has empathy for a child can also hurt that child, I believe that many pedophiles think they are loving the child victim, not harming them. I don’t think their brains work the same way that yours or mine does. But they have a type of empathy and I thought the discussion around this was valuable. I really appreciate hearing more about your reasons for doing the Sterns interview. As you said, it is rare that we ever get to hear from parents or families of accused perpetrators. I hope you will continue to be guided by your own experiences and personal integrity regarding the things you cover and the way you cover them. I appreciate how carefully you speak and the depth of your research, and imagine that takes a lot of time. But it’s what makes your coverage so unique and valuable in my opinion. I have such great respect for both of you. Take care of yourselves and each other 💜

Lisa Fowler

2024-09-30 08:56:40 +0000 UTC

Also, I’m really glad you all are delving into Delphi. I look forward to the insight you all bring to the tough cases.

Rebecca Hayes

2024-09-30 01:52:53 +0000 UTC

I appreciate this interview and thank you for giving us this insight into his parent’s lives and emotions. I think Stephan is a skilled manipulator and groomer. Groomers don’t just groom their victims. They groom the family of the victim to gain access. He was such a skilled manipulator that nobody involved (that I’ve heard) says they can believe that he could have done this. Nobody actually knew him. He likely chose Jenn because of her mental health struggles and groomed her and Maddie over years.

Rebecca Hayes

2024-09-30 01:12:44 +0000 UTC

I’m SUPER excited for Annie Elise’s live even more now!! My husband & I bought tickets over a month ago. What an awesome bonus that Lauren will be there. God loves a parade… I feel like I just won a lottery!!!!

Mama T

2024-09-30 00:43:20 +0000 UTC

I found it telling when Lauren asked what they loved about Stephan. His mama only talked about his love of animals. I found that very odd.

Martha Alexander

2024-09-29 23:58:54 +0000 UTC

I'm really glad you are being so understanding of his parents. I can't even imagine the pain they are going through.

shanna david

2024-09-29 21:02:35 +0000 UTC

We Need to Talk About Kevin is one of my favorite books! I never realized why until now.

Johanna Farra

2024-09-29 20:34:43 +0000 UTC

Thank you for this behind-the-scenes look at Stephen's behavior. I wonder if one component of his behavior is that he was not allowed to grow up. Did his parents prevent him from fully developing into an adult? Is that something that can contribute to an inappropriate attraction to children?

Laura Carson

2024-09-29 16:37:26 +0000 UTC

I agree. I don’t consider it to be real empathy and not sure how kind he was to animals either

MAC

2024-09-29 16:22:47 +0000 UTC

I found interview to be a great learning opportunity. Even on parenting

MAC

2024-09-29 16:16:12 +0000 UTC

Loved the authenticity of this conversation! Thanks for sharing!

Peter and Carly H

2024-09-29 08:25:10 +0000 UTC

Thank you Lauren and Dr. John for the interview and your professionalism.

CJ

2024-09-29 05:12:04 +0000 UTC

I appreciate this. But the parents aside (their reaction makes sense). I’m on the fence about Jen (only as far as knowledge about that night, which I don’t think she knows) although I can’t help but assume some degree of neglect was a major factor on the table for her derivative use immunity for that one interview that we know about. I’d really like to hear your thoughts on her two incredibly damning comments, including “the Woody Allen situation,” and her text to Sterns… “She’s no longer sleeping with me, I can’t risk it.” It’s all terrible and sad, but we now know these comments from her exist. I would suppose there are “levels” of grooming. Right? It all just sucks.

Lynette Byrnes

2024-09-29 01:57:56 +0000 UTC

I think that Deb has some issues and the Dad or is Chris the Step Dad? I heard that out there in an interview? Just wanted Stephen to be productive and independent. No matter what our parents do shape us in some ways but ultimately Stephen is responsible for what he has done. Jen has responsibility too though for letting Stephen into Maddie’s life and being reckless and irresponsible. This whole thing is not over. I wonder about other victims? Was he selling the photos? Just so many unanswered questions? I think another thing that bothers is me is some of Jen’s comments. The Woody Allen comment and the comment about she didn’t want to risk sleeping with Maddie? Was Maddie pregnant? I think the Parents are in denial about why Stephen did this but know he did this. They want to blame it on the TBI but that does not cause pedophilia and murder. Yes there were comments that make your ears go up and definitely make us go hhhhhhhmmmmmm. We will have to watch this play out. I am thankful the Parents did the interview because it gives us so much insight. I also am glad Dr. John can break it down for us.

Kay Louise

2024-09-28 23:18:06 +0000 UTC

I really appreciate getting a professional set of eyes on this case and one that can speak from a clinical perspective. I’m going into my second year of grad school to become a clinical mental health counselor (still so new to everything and have a long way to go) but when you brought up the discussion of the empathy and that not all perpetrators are the same, I was very happy to hear you say this. My professor who is actually about to retire (sad face). She is the director of counseling at my university. She mentioned this exact thing not even a week back. As a student in my course sat there saying how he could never ever work with or sit in front of a child sex offender etc. and what does he do if he has to see one. She firmly said this exact thing that you are saying. That not all perpetrators are the same. There is more that meets the eye than they are a “child sex offender”, and something about those statements stood out to me. Do I want to work with a child sex offender in the future? Probably not. I’m just as disturbed by them as the next person. But the fact is, is that there is something there that led them to this. And anyone who is interested in the psychology behind it, or has an explanation behind it, has my full attention. Especially you, with what you had to say here about this empathy thing. It was so interesting and so similar to what my professor just mentioned about a week back.

Lady MaeRae

2024-09-28 23:04:02 +0000 UTC

I think A LOT of people are completely missing the point with Jenn… yes, she might not have known but that’s NOT the point. A parent has a legal responsibility to care for / protect their child - she didn’t. It’s truly that simple. People are pissed that her actions lead to her daughter’s abuse and death. Jenn’s own actions & statements is the problem.

Katelyn Roy

2024-09-28 22:54:48 +0000 UTC

FWIWGray Hughes is not a reliable source of anything other than click bait BS. I very much appreciated this interview. I loved the question about empathy etc because the answers may have offered some insight into the environment Stefan came from. I especially appreciated how the Stearns refused to apologize for loving their son.

DaleK.

2024-09-28 22:36:29 +0000 UTC

Hello Emily I must say I appreciate your comment. You have expressed so well feelings that I’m sure many feel. I didn’t have a word for what I’ve felt towards him but a slow rage along with added bitterness I thought was long gone for people that SA children which he did along with the murder.

Terrie

2024-09-28 22:28:03 +0000 UTC

Right?! I heard her say that and immediately thought, if she let that slip publicly, I wonder what her personality is really like. And when the comment was made about ‘leaving California when people went crazy’ gave me the vibes they are extreme right conspiracy types. That’s me totally jumping to conclusions but there were a couple comments that made me go hhhhmmmm.

Lauren Rencher

2024-09-28 22:25:06 +0000 UTC

This 🙌 Thank you for explaining. Xxx

Lauren Schultz

2024-09-28 20:54:36 +0000 UTC

I don’t think he’s a psychopath either and I do think Jenn was wholly manipulated. It’s driving me nuts that everyone seems to be baying for her blood. I also agree that he was “in love” with Maddie, she was his primary relationship. It does strike me that he kept volunteering 3 pieces of unsolicited information 1) that he last saw Maddie looking through her bag (we know he damaged the bag and it’s contents with paint before throwing in the bin) 2) That Maddie had a crush on a boy 3) That Maddie was so happy, These are obviously sensitive things at the forefront of his mind and he is needed to create a narrative around these areas of sensitivity which may point to the crush being the reason he got angry and killed her ( though I don’t discount the theory of accidental strangulation related to sexual asphyxiation) I found the interview hard to listen to - it felt purely self motivated. They didn’t ask for your opinion about why their son would do this- for them it wasn’t an exploratory conversation, it was a PR campaign. I feel for them as humans and parents and what I say is not to blame them (as much as they leave a bad taste in my mouth) we all do our best as parents and none of us want this for our child or for our child to be the cause of such suffering I think digging in to the psychological aspects that offers a deeper more meaningful truth is important. I believe, from what I observed, what has been self reported, reported by others- that Debra was a harsh and controlling woman utilising emotional manipulation often and probably frightened Stephan as a child - his father is calm but is mentally and verbally manipulative. It seems he aspired to be seen as “better” in a social context and wanted for his son to be someone he could channel adoration and “respect” through his son’s career and financial success. This expectation was burdensome on Stephan who felt he couldn’t live up to it. I think they vacillated between coddling and end of rope type anger resulting in harsher than necessary punishments vs guidance of Stephan as a child. There was no room for error with his father and his mother would crumble to Stephans vulnerability and they both defended him to outsiders as an extension of self protection and image management of them as partners. There was no mentorship of parent to child in preparing him for independence, accountability etc in preparation for (what should have been) the inevitability of flying the nest. All this encouraged (by necessity) the path of over taking his parents in terms of sophistication in his manipulation. Probably the only time he felt concern from his parents on a genuine level was when he was run over And from all these things results a man child who is afraid of real live adult women, and a comfort with children who cannot view him as a disappointment in the way women would. It’s more than just a stunting of psychological growth and being firmly stuck in that stage. He is stuck at forever 8 years old because it was at that stage that he found his power in seeking sympathy from his parents to manipulate to his advantage outgrowing the vulnerability and dependence on parents of his age - it was at that stage he mentally outgrew his parents. He is simultaneously stunted and mature in that moment. It happened way too prematurely so he is stuck in both regression and premature progression. these thoughts are just me thinking through what I think- I’m not asserting them as fact.

Ellie Theo

2024-09-28 20:50:17 +0000 UTC

This was an exceptional interview, giving us rare insight into a complex situation. We would all like things to be simple, not to have „positive „ words like empathy applied to people we view as monsters, to be able to divide the world clearly into good and bad and find ourselves firmly on the side of the good. The truth is, nothing is that simple. Thank you both for this.

Jaqueline Jones

2024-09-28 20:29:37 +0000 UTC

Your interview was great. Well done, thorough and very professional. I guess the folks who have criticized you are reacting to their emotions around issues of child abuse and murder. Everyone has or has had children in their lives. The care for children and fears of what can happen to them engages a helpless rage in people. I think that rage slopped over onto his parents and then onto both of you. These parents may not have done anything to create this tragedy. Genetics are tricky, and then there are the general life experiences that also shape “monsters”. It is very brave of these parents to step forward. Wasn’t that what people wanted the Laudries to do? You can’t please all the people all the time and, again, some of the feedback you are getting is emotionally driven.

Roberta S Treacy

2024-09-28 19:28:05 +0000 UTC

Thanks for sharing your thoughts! We'll consider making it public or re-recording it. I appreciate you sharing why you think this is important

Lauren and John Matthias

2024-09-28 19:25:57 +0000 UTC

This was very needed, thank you. I understand wanting to have this behind a pay wall, but I'll say I think commentary like this publicly is needed. Whether it's this exact interview, or redoing it in a way that would make you both feel comfortable, I think it's worth considering. In this particular podcast, I dont think you've said anything that would seem like a betrayal to the Sterns at all, in fact I think it only helps their public perception. It might be worth while to make something like this public. I say this because I was someone who found myself feeling pretty upset listening to it; I honestly had a very difficult time getting thru it. I even had to cut it off at the very end. While this podcast helped clarify things, it felt at the time like a "poor Stephan" interview, like he's a victim because of the TBI. They said they know he did it, but it felt like they, specificallu DS, had more anger at the police, jail (i understand that one because solitary is inhumane imo), and Jen. Even victim blaming Maddie when she said why didnt Maddie lock her door? So I think it would be worth while to publicly bring more perspective to the interview, in whatever way you feel comfortable. Maybe even just editing this one. Idk. Also, I'm glad you played the last clip of her talking about execution, because the very last few minutes I just couldn't make it thru. But it was worth highlighting that clip. Thanks again for what you do. 🫶

Emily M.

2024-09-28 19:15:17 +0000 UTC

So well done and through. Thanks guys 🙏

Jennifer Hazard

2024-09-28 18:06:28 +0000 UTC

This was great. I would like to see your thoughts on Colonel Russell Williams from Canada.

Gaylea Maddox

2024-09-28 18:03:26 +0000 UTC

Hoping I could hear your thoughts after this interview! The trauma a person experiences and being able to talk about it and get back into society by explaining it in words (of what happened) is really helpful to me. Thanks.

ShaRee

2024-09-28 17:30:01 +0000 UTC

I appreciated the interview. Why? Because regardless of Stephan’s upbringing, he is 100% responsible for his life choices as an adult. It was interesting to watch the parents though. They are a LOT older than the pictures that are floating around online. In these older pictures, they look more confident, assertive, and physically fit/capable. Except.. they are elderly now. They have health issues and are struggling as is, then this has been added to their plate. I believed Deb when she said “we’re too old to be dealing with this”. I’ve heard my own grandparents say this. IMHO, “empathy” is not truly empathy in Stephan’s case. In order for it to be empathy, they have to understand boundaries. Stephan lacks in this. He becomes enmeshed with anyone who was willing to give him attention. He picked someone vulnerable and shame on him for that.

Ashley G 🦋

2024-09-28 17:02:47 +0000 UTC

I greatly appreciated the interview and found it incredibly informative.

CBell

2024-09-28 15:48:40 +0000 UTC

Lauren and John, this was an excellent interview and the fact that you were even able to do it is what makes what you do so unique and important. As a therapist there was a lot of insight gained through meeting Stephan’s parents in this way and I ache for their pain. I’m grateful for their willingness to share their experience with us.

kim Johnson

2024-09-28 15:41:48 +0000 UTC

Thank you for you ethical reporting and thought insights on such a difficult case. 🫶

Angela Pedersen

2024-09-28 15:35:43 +0000 UTC

Empathy itself occurs in degrees. Some people are more empathetic than others or empathetic regarding some things and not others. People are complicated. My father abused me and he was not a pedophile or a psychopath. He was a narcissist but he was the more “empathetic” of my two parents. If you believe only completely evil people are dangerous to your kids then your kids will be more vulnerable to the most frequent perpetrators.

kim Johnson

2024-09-28 15:32:22 +0000 UTC

I’m at min 10.17. Was that message from Chris or Debra? I’m following a path of thought that I need enough little pieces to line up, in order to come to a theory.

TC

2024-09-28 15:19:19 +0000 UTC

You are absolutely right on with these issues.

Carla Perkins

2024-09-28 13:53:18 +0000 UTC

You guys have been going full blast for months and months, you deserve a break! ❤️ Dr. John are you still working your other job?? As an older parent of young ones I know that the lack of access to grandparents to help makes things so hard.

Lauren Leiendecker

2024-09-28 13:50:40 +0000 UTC

Thank you for this! It still upsets me that while they blame Jen, the closet people to Stephen, didn't see any signs from him or warning signs. I do feel bad for them but I do feel horrible for Jen. I think Stephen was very good at making people comfortable and trust him. It's a scary world and poor Maddie went through so much! Heartbreaking 💔 You two are amazing and I see where you're coming from! Thank you!

Stormy

2024-09-28 13:37:23 +0000 UTC

Thank you for such an insightful show and a holistic approach to these crimes. You help us understand the human experience from all perspectives. I am grateful for what you do.

cmoxie

2024-09-28 12:22:41 +0000 UTC

Looking forward to the new Patreon episode and loving Lauren’s journalistic type edited videos popping up.

Tad Auty

2024-09-28 12:17:28 +0000 UTC

This interview hit home for me. Thank you so much for sharing this. It was so important to hear how mindful Dr. John is about splitting the job of listening and making judgments. After John Hinckley attempted to assassinate President Reagan, my dad talked about how he imagined John Hinckley's parents must have felt. (My brother was diagnosed as manic depressive, which is a term not used today, a few years before the shooting.) There was always that phone call that Dad dreaded would come that would change his life, because of something my brother did. Dr. John and Lauren, you bring healing to others.

Robin Murray

2024-09-28 12:15:05 +0000 UTC

Unconditional love of your children in jail? Yeah I couldn’t stop LOvING them- but supporting them? I wouldn’t want to soften his punishment- I think that I’d be lovingly leaving them for a while to sit with what they did. And after processing some of my own feelings, I would be in touch. I wouldn’t be sending money for treats. Love doesn’t always mean rewarding bad behaviour- But I would also be blaming myself that they ended up there. That my raising them or my genes contributed- so I imagine in under 13 months I’d be visiting them. But I’m afraid there would be conditions- if they did commit the crime, I would want them to own it. It’s how they were raised. No forgiveness without a sorry. I think I’d struggle visiting and chatting about the weather if I’m emotionally supporting them as they keep a secret and try to avoid justice being brought- which also is impacting all the family members.

Tad Auty

2024-09-28 12:07:49 +0000 UTC

Well said John- I understood why you asked about empathy. Child offenders are not always old ogres with no charming qualities- otherwise fewer kids wouid be abused. They can charm and act caring/ some may even care- but not acknowledge the abuse is actually abuse. Regarding the parents- I wouodnt want to harass them - but I did find it disturbing that they said zero responsibility for their son. As a parent myself- if any of my kids ended up capable of something like this. … I wouid absolutely be going over my parenting and pointing holes in how I’d raised them. What I hadn’t protected them from- or in this case- did I enable him and possibly allow him to he enotioankym stunted as he didn’t develop independent adult living skills. Not that they can cure a paedophile- but what if part of his attracting to children was like michel Jackson who appeared to see them as his peers? Anyways I just would have liked to hear them say how sorry they were if they contributed to making a murderer. As for Jenn- I don’t think she knew about the murder- and I don’t think she deserves to be blamed for that- but she lost me at fearing Maddie and Stephan may have a woody Allen situation. Why would you worry about that without a clue there’s an unatially close connection- and IF that was something you were worried about, why put them in the same bed together? And if she slept in with her mother every night- why the sending her off with him alone THaT night? People often injure their children unintentionally- I believe she was negligent and put her boyfriends above her child and if I did that and my child was harmed- I would feel I deserve to it for that. If I did the very basic level of protecting my child, that wouldn’t have happened. I do appreciate the parents speaking by and that they’re processing- maybe down the track they’ll speak to you again and they work through it more. Maybe they’ll have a bit more insight. They didn’t commit the crime- and they didn’t want to lose their child- but they also bred a criminal- so it’s not black and white or something you couod sort out in your head in months when you’ve had that child for decades.

Tad Auty

2024-09-28 11:50:48 +0000 UTC

I am so grateful to you two for your amazing work. It's so easy to label perpetrators and their families, but I am so grateful to have you two who listen with intelligence and empathy. I am so heartbreaking for Maddie. This case brings me tremendous sadness. Thank you for covering this case.

Lenny Wen

2024-09-28 10:44:06 +0000 UTC

Adding a second comment: There must be such a disconnect for them between the son they love and the acts he has committed. How can anyone concile the two? I don’t know if I could really take it in. Wouldn’t it be almost like another person did the acts although you intellectually know it’s your child who did it?

Imia

2024-09-28 10:26:02 +0000 UTC

Thank you Dr John and Lauren for this insight into your approach to the interview and your thoughts on it. It adds valuable context. I appreciate how you’re measured and thoughtful and help us all look deeper and see the complexities of life, even in the worst parts of it.

Imia

2024-09-28 10:20:17 +0000 UTC

As a survivor, I have always said that my abusers cultivated their place and manipulated my parents - almost grooming them also.

Lala Del Bray

2024-09-28 09:25:11 +0000 UTC

I struggled listening to them. I have yet to complete the interview because I get upset, no reason for this tragedy. I will keep working on trying to listen. Hugs to you both and all you do!!!

Marybeth

2024-09-28 09:22:05 +0000 UTC

I've been intrigued at some YT channels' reactions to your interview. It won't fix everything wrong in this space but it humanized them and possibly reminded some of us that they are also victims quite separately from Madelaine and her family.

Lala Del Bray

2024-09-28 09:09:27 +0000 UTC

Annie Elise/serialously is great. She does an excellent job of doing deep dives. I’ll go paddling boarding for 6-8 hours at a time and typically I spend half the time catching up with you guys and Annie Elise. Both podcasts are very well done :)

Brittany Rohr

2024-09-28 08:40:06 +0000 UTC

I was so glad to hear you both say that even if your son did anything like SS that you would still unconditionally love him. Because I 150% believe parents don’t get that option.. when you become a parent you don’t get the luxury of turning your back on them completely… you don’t have to like what they did or the decisions they make but I believe you still need to show that human who considers you their parent unconditional love and support even if it’s just emotional support… if your child’s behind bars buying them books and giving money for commissary I literally one of the only ways you can show your love besides just convo

Brittany Rohr

2024-09-28 08:33:55 +0000 UTC

I am not sure that empathy is the right word to describe Stephen's engaging with Maddie

Bonnie Schoeneman-Dilley

2024-09-28 08:12:43 +0000 UTC

Thank you for this episode. Of course there should be empathy for Stephen Sterns parents. Thank you for helping others to see this.

Cats&Dogs

2024-09-28 08:05:22 +0000 UTC

You two are amazing 👏. These parents really trusted you and you showed empathy and compassion to them while asking difficult questions with sensitivity.

Bonnie Schoeneman-Dilley

2024-09-28 07:55:32 +0000 UTC

Thank you!

Debi

2024-09-28 07:39:23 +0000 UTC

I really appreciated the way you shone a spotlight on how complex these cases and crimes can be, and how it's not all cut and dry. There are so many layers to this case, and you really helped emphasize the humanity in it all, for better or for worse. Very few people are all-good or all-bad. There isn't always a simple explanation for unspeakable things. I found Stephan's parents to be very genuine and forthcoming, and I really appreciate their courage to share their experience so we can better understand this tragedy and everyone involved.

Zefora

2024-09-28 06:13:15 +0000 UTC

I am so grateful for the both of you, the dynamic duo! It seems like stephan had a deviant sexual disorder that reaches way back to his teen years. Videotaping a friends parent in the bathroom, taping his roommates girlfriend in the bedroom unbeknownst to her, placing semen in girls drinks, etc. What causes these behaviors?

Renee Gruze

2024-09-28 05:50:27 +0000 UTC

Thank you Terrie for sharing. I'm so sorry you are going through all of this. I pray for your continued healing.

Hope4All

2024-09-28 05:14:50 +0000 UTC

Yes. As I have had both TBI and concussion. There are different degrees and synonyms that follow these type injuries. My DI brain injury to left frontal lobe was misdiagnosed for some time due to my normal functioning of walking, talking, able to dress, and have normal bodily functions. What I did have immediately, loss of consciousness, migraines, nausea, dizziness, vomiting, loss of memory. As time went on increased symptoms began as my abrasions, black eye, knot, migraine began to heal. Memory loss each day began, cognitive understanding in speech and communication began. I was extremely slow in functioning daily tasks and at work my skills were greatly hindered with multitasking and memory. Symptoms were not going away and became more obvious. I could not differentiate color, depth, and distance. Ex: stop at a green light and drive thru a red. Hit the curbs while turn corners. I immediately stopped driving. They began test for seizures due to sleeping issues with no remembrance of fits, clamping jar, etc. Then are the neurological tests and the behavior tests began. It was long hours of testing and specific tests given. Long story short, two years of memory loss: my migraines decreased, I gained back most all skills. Lasting effects were no flashing lights, sirens, flashlights anything directly looking at like that. Different patterns on clothes, carpet, walls… will cause brain shut down immediately nausea, migraine, sweating, confusion, inability to think or walk straight. My 1st diagnosis was mild closed brain trauma with deficits @ six months after initial head hit. I hope this helps, I won’t go into concussion and moderate brain trauma to which I know both unfortunately. I called this the light is on but nobody is 🏡 home. All looks well on outside, but inside things are loose, broken, and being healed. 🌿🕊️

Terrie

2024-09-28 05:07:14 +0000 UTC

Sterns seems to have had a perfect childhood... until his accident. Very engaged parents.

katherine dinero

2024-09-28 04:26:01 +0000 UTC

Hi all... I'm finally here & supporting You 2... I've been subscribed since day 1 of it all... sending love from Mesa, Arizona... Lori's still in jail here in Phoenix. Ty Laura & Dr. John Mathias ❤️

katherine dinero

2024-09-28 04:22:36 +0000 UTC

You are always so ethical, empathetic and thoughtful in your responses, insights and interviews. Thank you for this.

Spring20

2024-09-28 04:09:05 +0000 UTC

I have wondered if he had a concussion that was not properly diagnosed and treated. That would not be uncommon, unfortunately! I do wonder about mom’s comments about not wanting him to remain overnight in the hospital, did she have a choice that she made, that she could take him home and return if he didn’t have symptoms immediately of a concussion or more serious brain injury?

Erin Aboudara

2024-09-28 04:03:07 +0000 UTC

Delphi is another hard one. I am still trying to follow BK in Ada county, Richens and Shana Gardner and of course there will be Lori in Arizona.

Kay Louise

2024-09-28 03:47:50 +0000 UTC

Can one have a TBI that doesn't require hospitalization?

Hope4All

2024-09-28 03:45:23 +0000 UTC

Thank you. Be kind to yourselves. We’ll wait! ❤️

JenAus

2024-09-28 03:45:19 +0000 UTC

I will always remember an interview with a man in Idaho in a car about the missing little boy Monkey. People got upset and I also think of a couple of others like the blue barrel case when the victim got free. People get angry about how can you speak to potential criminals or interview witnesses with information. This is good journalism and for Dr. John because he evaluates information and fact etc… These interviews are invaluable for information and to try to understand why these things happen? I am proud of you that you were and are strong and open minded to do the jobs you do. These discussions are truly important to get into the minds of the criminal and to understand crimes that are so senseless. So many times we don’t get to hear from families or parents. Really this is an outstanding interview. As for the Sterns they are his Parents and they have their feelings and emotions. They have their burdens and grief.

Kay Louise

2024-09-28 03:43:52 +0000 UTC

Thank you for this. It really changed my perspective on the interview

MMB

2024-09-28 03:41:06 +0000 UTC

I am so interested to hear your guys takes on the interview. I found it really illuminating. I can see a lot of the idiosyncrasies and blind spots that helped to shape Stephan into the person who decided to be a monster. It also does seem like they really did try to support him with the resources they had. A lot of progress has been made in the last 30 years as far as brain health, mental health, and childhood development, and the “give a fuck” and diagnostics towards behavioural struggles in kids has come a long way and the resources available now, or even known about now, are a lot more comprehensive. As much as they surely had /have short comings, they do truely seem like if they had known that Stephan was consuming CESAM material, that they would intervened. And if they had known he was abusing Maddie that they wouldn’t have overlooked it. Could they have been more diligent? Yes. Were there warning signs they should have taken more seriously, probably. But they don’t seem willfully enabling. Interviews like this really ask us to look into the uncomfortable space of our humanity and sit with this other side of the suffering inflicted. How do we relate to “the mother of a monster”. We all love our children and try to set them up for success, but at the end of the day, they grow into adults and some of them choose to be monsters. It asks us to think about the sons and daughters and spouses and parents of these monsters, who did not commit any crimes and did not choose to be forever connected to monsters. I’m interested in seeing how they grow and heal and change as time progresses. They seem to be fortunate enough to not be trapped with rigid thinking, and hopefully that helps them heal.

Vanessa French

2024-09-28 03:39:16 +0000 UTC

You both did so well being open and safe for the Sterns. They needed so badly to be heard. Their interview wiped away a lot of false assumptions I had that I didn’t realize I had. Great job you two. 🩵

CB1

2024-09-28 03:29:45 +0000 UTC

Yes, Stephen’s Parents struggle to rationalize what and why he has done what he has done. I was shocked when his Mother called him a troglodyte.

Kay Louise

2024-09-28 03:26:05 +0000 UTC

They are not their son’s actions. They had the courage to speak their truth. The interview was interesting. All credit to you both for the honesty and integrity you bring to your work.

JenAus

2024-09-28 03:25:12 +0000 UTC

Thank you Lauren and Dr. John for the coverage of this case. It is disturbing.

Sharon Ashcraft

2024-09-28 03:18:31 +0000 UTC

Thank you for this behind-the-scenes and the insights into motivations. I appreciate the parents doing this interview while processing the horror of their son’s actions. I also deeply appreciate Dr. John drlving into the complex interactions of the people and personalities involved.

TN Laura

2024-09-28 03:10:47 +0000 UTC

💎 As always Dr. John and Lauren I appreciate the breakdown. I’m so glad that the Sterns came on. My heart goes out to them. I will not cast stone at them. That breaks my heart the pain they are enduring. Prayers and peace to all family members in this case. 🌿🕊️ ⚖️ Justice for Maddie⚖️

Terrie

2024-09-28 02:51:44 +0000 UTC

Looking forward to this. Going to listen while I garden ❤️

JenAus

2024-09-28 02:50:06 +0000 UTC

Going to go down the rabbit hole. This case is just hard to do! Thank you Dr. John and Lauren.

Kay Louise

2024-09-28 02:49:15 +0000 UTC

BEHIND THE SCENES: Debra and Chris Sterns Interview | Our thoughts

Comments

I feel so sorry for this mother and father, it’s really sad, but I’m afraid Maddie is not getting full justice.

Curious about their response that neither of their parenting contributed to his dysfunctional behaviour ….I’ve made loads of mistakes as a parent- interesting they don’t Dad had long affair when SS was young, mother allegedly paid off friend for SS secret pics of female room mate

Maybe you should try it ….you ain’t 20 no more

WNTTAK is one of my favourite books :)

A gun plus children really- barely out of 6th grade- they didn't know what might happen or what to do

Just joined, currently binging backwards. I still think pedophiles deserve much, much longer sentences. But that’s a whole different discussion 🥰

I joined your patron just for this, I have never joined patron for anyone else. The psychology of crime fascinates me. I feel like them acknowledging that Stephan was the sole perpetrator didn't fully come across so I appreciate this behind the scenes.

Thank you for the interview and sharing your thoughts afterwards. I do think his parents separation affected him, the secrets they’ve kept from him. However, he had a choice and chose wrong. He deserves whatever he’s getting.

This is yet another example of why I chose to financially support THIS podcast. It is so helpful to understand what Dr. John does in his day job. I learn so much from you two. Thank you for all you do, the professionalism you show, and the empathy you have for everyone.

Super excited about that philosophical show you're putting together! The psychology and philosophy that Dr John gives in these episodes is definitely something I value about your content! It's very intriguing, and I'm here for it!

Huh?

More important is your over-doing lip injections, and literally frying your facial skin…watch out for skin cancer.

So many questions. You add different angle. It’s so confusing. I do hope, as you do, we are able to get more understanding. It may come at trial as more conversations take place and more evidence is brought to 💡 light.

I am very interested in whether they can find Stephan’s other child victims. There are always other victims.

I joined patreon to watch this specific video.

It also reminds me of Lori's sister. Summer. People have been really upset that she stays a bit supportive of Lori

I feel like there were some jail calls that the mom had with Stefan, it sounded like she was blaming Jen and his family. I'd love to hear her thought process around all of that...

Mom said he had a core 4 or 5 group of friends; yet, they said there lots of kids going in and out all the time… contradictory???

You are so sweet, Hope. Ty. I’m truly blessed and appreciate your prayers. Blessings and peace to you🕊️

Also, I’m really glad you all are delving into Delphi. I look forward to the insight you all bring to the tough cases.

I’m SUPER excited for Annie Elise’s live even more now!! My husband & I bought tickets over a month ago. What an awesome bonus that Lauren will be there. God loves a parade… I feel like I just won a lottery!!!!

I found it telling when Lauren asked what they loved about Stephan. His mama only talked about his love of animals. I found that very odd.

I'm really glad you are being so understanding of his parents. I can't even imagine the pain they are going through.

We Need to Talk About Kevin is one of my favorite books! I never realized why until now.

Thank you for this behind-the-scenes look at Stephen's behavior. I wonder if one component of his behavior is that he was not allowed to grow up. Did his parents prevent him from fully developing into an adult? Is that something that can contribute to an inappropriate attraction to children?

I agree. I don’t consider it to be real empathy and not sure how kind he was to animals either

I found interview to be a great learning opportunity. Even on parenting

Loved the authenticity of this conversation! Thanks for sharing!

Thank you Lauren and Dr. John for the interview and your professionalism.

This 🙌 Thank you for explaining. Xxx

Thanks for sharing your thoughts! We'll consider making it public or re-recording it. I appreciate you sharing why you think this is important

So well done and through. Thanks guys 🙏

This was great. I would like to see your thoughts on Colonel Russell Williams from Canada.

Hoping I could hear your thoughts after this interview! The trauma a person experiences and being able to talk about it and get back into society by explaining it in words (of what happened) is really helpful to me. Thanks.

I greatly appreciated the interview and found it incredibly informative.

Thank you for you ethical reporting and thought insights on such a difficult case. 🫶

I’m at min 10.17. Was that message from Chris or Debra? I’m following a path of thought that I need enough little pieces to line up, in order to come to a theory.

You are absolutely right on with these issues.

You guys have been going full blast for months and months, you deserve a break! ❤️ Dr. John are you still working your other job?? As an older parent of young ones I know that the lack of access to grandparents to help makes things so hard.

Thank you for such an insightful show and a holistic approach to these crimes. You help us understand the human experience from all perspectives. I am grateful for what you do.

Looking forward to the new Patreon episode and loving Lauren’s journalistic type edited videos popping up.

I am so grateful to you two for your amazing work. It's so easy to label perpetrators and their families, but I am so grateful to have you two who listen with intelligence and empathy. I am so heartbreaking for Maddie. This case brings me tremendous sadness. Thank you for covering this case.

Thank you Dr John and Lauren for this insight into your approach to the interview and your thoughts on it. It adds valuable context. I appreciate how you’re measured and thoughtful and help us all look deeper and see the complexities of life, even in the worst parts of it.

As a survivor, I have always said that my abusers cultivated their place and manipulated my parents - almost grooming them also.

I struggled listening to them. I have yet to complete the interview because I get upset, no reason for this tragedy. I will keep working on trying to listen. Hugs to you both and all you do!!!

I've been intrigued at some YT channels' reactions to your interview. It won't fix everything wrong in this space but it humanized them and possibly reminded some of us that they are also victims quite separately from Madelaine and her family.

Annie Elise/serialously is great. She does an excellent job of doing deep dives. I’ll go paddling boarding for 6-8 hours at a time and typically I spend half the time catching up with you guys and Annie Elise. Both podcasts are very well done :)

I am not sure that empathy is the right word to describe Stephen's engaging with Maddie

Thank you for this episode. Of course there should be empathy for Stephen Sterns parents. Thank you for helping others to see this.

You two are amazing 👏. These parents really trusted you and you showed empathy and compassion to them while asking difficult questions with sensitivity.

Thank you!

Thank you Terrie for sharing. I'm so sorry you are going through all of this. I pray for your continued healing.

Sterns seems to have had a perfect childhood... until his accident. Very engaged parents.

Hi all... I'm finally here & supporting You 2... I've been subscribed since day 1 of it all... sending love from Mesa, Arizona... Lori's still in jail here in Phoenix. Ty Laura & Dr. John Mathias ❤️

You are always so ethical, empathetic and thoughtful in your responses, insights and interviews. Thank you for this.

Delphi is another hard one. I am still trying to follow BK in Ada county, Richens and Shana Gardner and of course there will be Lori in Arizona.

Can one have a TBI that doesn't require hospitalization?

Thank you. Be kind to yourselves. We’ll wait! ❤️

Thank you for this. It really changed my perspective on the interview

You both did so well being open and safe for the Sterns. They needed so badly to be heard. Their interview wiped away a lot of false assumptions I had that I didn’t realize I had. Great job you two. 🩵

Yes, Stephen’s Parents struggle to rationalize what and why he has done what he has done. I was shocked when his Mother called him a troglodyte.

They are not their son’s actions. They had the courage to speak their truth. The interview was interesting. All credit to you both for the honesty and integrity you bring to your work.

Thank you Lauren and Dr. John for the coverage of this case. It is disturbing.

Thank you for this behind-the-scenes and the insights into motivations. I appreciate the parents doing this interview while processing the horror of their son’s actions. I also deeply appreciate Dr. John drlving into the complex interactions of the people and personalities involved.

Looking forward to this. Going to listen while I garden ❤️

Going to go down the rabbit hole. This case is just hard to do! Thank you Dr. John and Lauren.

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