Patreon Policy:

You're right, there is some overlap between fans of our projects. Its always kind of neat to see to see who people follow, and I always find it a little surreal (In the best possible way) to discover a well known and well respected creator pays attention to my work. :D I agree. You've got to stand up for your beliefs, and you have to stand together with those who share your beliefs, of you'll eventually find yourself standing alone and oppressed on all sides. I don;t like the new rules, though I'm sure Patreon is just trying to protect their long term interests. That said, if you're going to do something like this, you don't just broadside the community with a bunch of new guidelines like this. You should address the community, let them help craft those new rules, and make those rules clear enough that people can understand them. I think the biggest problem with all of this is that we're receiving so many mixed and conflicting messages on what's happening that its got us all in a panic because we aren't entirely sure what exactly is happening. That's right, we all do what we have to do in order to get by. I've actually seen a couple of alternatives to Patreon being discussed around the forums I frequent. Even if all of this resolves itself soon, I think one or two other similar sites out there would be a good thing. In any market, competition is a good thing as it forces a company to court a customer's (Us in this case) favor to draw them in, to give them better and friendlier features to thrive against their competitors. My top priority remains creating the best game I can while paying my bills on the home front. If there are alternative ways to do that, I'll be happy to look at all options and figure out what will work best for me and the fans of my projects in the long run. ;)

Aftermath Team

Thanks, but we have the same fan base and you've actually launched and finished a working game already, so you're not little at all, haha! :-D Tbh, my reaction to these new "rules" at taking out the social features outside is motivated just by principle. My theory is that if we roll over with this, the next thing will be worse. But I understand it is a big decision and most people won't have the option to not complying with their demands. At any rate, we keep doing what we must.

LOK Team

I'm not too worried about it. In all honesty, I expect this this whole situation to stew for a couple more weeks. Some people will leave, some feelings will be hurt, and things will go largely back to what it was before. Their censorship will remain selective, I'll keep doing what I was planning to do anyway (After all, the vast majority of what I create falls well within the realm of what they deem acceptable, and much of the rest is things you would have to actively go looking for anyway.) , and if I ever get flagged, I'll do what I can to fix it. On that note, one of the nice things about how we're building Inheritance is that we're compartmentalizing most of the content in the game in such a way that if it ever DOES become an issue, the offending material can be isolated quickly and easily. And assuming it ever comes to that, I'll make an effort to post the "clean" version here and find some other way to get you guys the "complete" version of the game. ;)

Aftermath Team

Honestly? How would they know? It's one thing for them to watch a porn video and say "oh no, bdsm, our puritanical virtue is sullied!" but it would take a lot more effort to review and censor a work like Inheritance. Except that you just told them

I've heard the same, that the "Adult" community makes up a large percentage of their creators, and an even larger percentage of their income. It almost feels to me like they are biting the hand the feeds them. I've always made an effort to avoid putting anything out in the open that someone isn't likely to accidentally stumble across. I've always tried to make clear the kind of content I present (Though I have been going back and purging my page of some things in recent days to make it less likely that anything will potentially get me in trouble.) Fallback location or alternate funding source is something I've seen a LOT of talk about in recent days, both on and off of Patreon. I'm keeping my eyes pealed as well, but it really doesn't look like there are many alternatives out there. Wanton Cove is close enough to complete (At least the main narrative) that I have no intentions to make any real changes to the game. If it gets flagged for any reason, I'll finish it and PM my Patrons a link to a final version without mentioning it on my Patreon page. Inheritance is a little trickier. The girls are sisters, if that proves to be an issue, then it should be easy to make a small change to make them "Raised like sisters" without the blood relation involved. The BDSM content is going to be fairly soft stuff at first, then ease into some of the darker stuff as the game grows (I personally prefer the lighter stuff, and I've got a friend who plans to write the harder stuff once the game is established a bit.) I think for Inheritance, there's enough "acceptable" content planned that needs to go into the game first, that we'll have a much better idea of what we can or can not do through Patreon before we start adding the more questionable content. I plan to keep going like I am for now, see how the dust settles on this issue, and plan any course corrections or unlocks if the need arises. ;) Short version: Do what I can that is CLEARLY within the rules for the time being, then when the rules are clearer, I can move into those areas But then, I've always been the kind of person who will do what I can, wait for the dust to settle so I can see where exactly I stand, then wade back into the malestorm for another run.

Aftermath Team

I'm pretty sure all their wording is intentionally vague and confusing. It's done that way so they can ban whatever they like whenever they like. I've seen it on plenty of sites, one thing will get banned but another that violates the same rules is given a pass. I'm pretty certain the vast majority of their biggest income providers are adult projects and I know at least half of them violate their silly rules. I'd suggest you try to keep your overview page clear of anything that might get you flagged and keep all updates to patrons only. Just post your free updates elsewhere. Look into setting up a fall back location like a blog and see if you can find some alternative funding method to patreon. Although not paypal, unless their policy changed they have a hate boner for adult content and are quite happy to steal your money if they feel you violated their policies. Outside of someone tattling to patreon I can't imagine them taking the time to actually play through any of the projects hosted on their site. At that point it probably won't matter if your game violates their policies or not they'll probably just throw you out based on hearsay because its quicker and easier then spending time policing content. I do hope you don't go dropping content plans or removing themes because of this because it would be a real shame. Perhaps if you're worried in that regard you can work out some sort of patch system. Get the game from here then get the "unlock" patch from your blog.

Thank you for the well wishes! Never realized that any of you fine people from the LOK team payed any attention to little old me. :D I for one am trying to comply with the rules (And honestly, I can only think of a couple of things in my work that are really shades of gray when it comes to their new policies, and I'll take action to soften those edges a little bit if push comes to shove. For the time being, I struggle to get by each month, so a large disruption to how I do things would be pretty rough on me and my family. That said, if there ever comes an alternative to this site, I wouldn't hesitate to look into it. Best of luck moving forward with your own project, its one of the real gems out there!

Aftermath Team

We're taking all the social features to a WordPress server managed by us. We're not putting up with this and I hope we're not the only ones. Best wishes from a comrade in arms. ^_^

LOK Team

That's the impression that I am under, that the adult community makes up a very large portion of their creators. And if the open letter thing is any indication, its upsetting more than just the NSFW creators as nearly as many SFW creators seem to be signing as well. I think you are right, this issue is proving very polarizing, and if they aren't careful its going to prove harmful to their bottom line. Its kind of like squeezing a bar of soap, you squeeze too hard and you're not only going to loose your grip on what you have, but its going to go flying somewhere else so fast you won't even know it happened until its too late. This is one of those cases of "If its not broken, don't fix it." But instead, they want to impose their own sense of morality, regardless of what the law on the issues might be, on creators who have different kinks than they do.

Aftermath Team

It just seems like the sort of thing that will kill Patreon eventually. I'm not completely sure on the numbers (as Patreon already censors much of this stuff already), but isn't adult content already most of the money flowing through the site? Tons of their biggest creators are adult content creators. The second someone creates a viable alternative for adult content, pretty much everyone will switch over there. It's not even like Patreon needs advertiser revenue, which is the usual excuse for this sort of behavior. I feel like they don't want to scare away potential patrons by getting a bad reputation.

john doe

Thank you for taking the time to check out the open letter. I agree that its unlikely to do a lot of good, but if there's enough push back over this, then you never know. I was actually following a conversation early this morning where several people were discussing alternatives to Patreon and the possibility of setting up an alternate if there isn't one. I'll be keeping my eye out for anything like that. I personally intend to conform to the new rules even if I don't agree with them, but I'd happily embrace a new community should anyone rise up to create a home that is welcoming to "adult" creators as a whole. Hatreon, heh. I don't hate Patreon, I think its an incredible system, and its an amazing platform for creators. I just find it a bit sad that they're so worried about offending someone that they feel the need to marginalize those who are not technically doing anything wrong. I think if something is illegal, then that's pretty cut and dry, it shouldn't be allowed. But at the same time, if its not illegal, then let people explore their fantasies through art, fiction, or similar formats. Where's the harm in it if people clearly indicate the kind(s) of content present in their games so there are no unexpected surprises?

Aftermath Team

I've added my name to the open letter, though I fear it will do little good. The moment a corporation starts to take its cues from something as Orwellian as a "Trust and Safety Council", I think it becomes very difficult for them to change their course. I like using Patreon, but given that its basic services aren't nearly as complex as something like YouTube, I'm hopeful that someone will be able to set up a competing service that *won't* go in this chilling direction. They just need to call it something less daft than Hatreon.

Ver Greeneyes