Colin's Last Stand, Episode 19: The Political Witch Hunt of Kathy Griffin and Bill Maher

I would love any politician that would say something like that to echo those words of yours. In this case it would be Trump, saying "she has no power whatsoever, but she has the freedom to express herself. While I think this is distasteful, I forgive her and don't want to see this witch hunt continue." The last people that needs to be censored in this country (personally no one should be but that is denying reality) are comedians because even if they are saying something horrible, people need to see that there is a lighter/darker side to everything that comedians find and show to everyone. There is nuance and uniqueness to everything, painting with a broad brush is laziness and we need to do better as a country and society.

ASully8018

Thank you!

Colin Moriarty

Thank you!

Colin Moriarty

Amen.

Colin Moriarty

Glass houses, and all of that. Good input!

Colin Moriarty

I appreciate it.

Colin Moriarty

I just really think she so stupidly hurt herself by lawyering up (for what?!) and doing what she did. Really injured her case.

Colin Moriarty

Thank you! I appreciate it.

Colin Moriarty

Thank you.

Colin Moriarty

You made the ethical choice. There's no doubt about it.

Colin Moriarty

Indeed. It sure will.

Colin Moriarty

We really must start differentiating between the power people hold over other people, and let the punishments fit the crime in that regard.

Colin Moriarty

That's a really fantastic point. Where were her people?

Colin Moriarty

Thank you.

Colin Moriarty

Thank you for your kind support!

Colin Moriarty

I think, with the supplementary video she did for the photo, she reminds us that sometimes mistakes aren't spur of the moment. Sometimes, we think things through, and they're still a mistake.

Colin Moriarty

Interesting viewpoint. I don't think we gain much of anything from being punitive to an absurd degree outside of some severe crimes.

Colin Moriarty

I didn't say the backlash is unwarranted or that she shouldn't pay. I said that we don't need to destroy human beings over mistakes and poor choices that have zero material effect on any of us.

Colin Moriarty

It's typically the same people over and over again.

Colin Moriarty

Indeed. Just watched that with Erin, in fact.

Colin Moriarty

Yup, you nailed it. Fight to win at all costs.

Colin Moriarty

Definitely finding your groove and making edits that keep things concise and focused. Loving it.

Justin Neal

Best episode yet.

Chris Holtzer

Ironically, Kathy Griffin distilled Socialism into a single image.

Jeremy Meyer

There is a pathological moral outrage plaguing the Internet and (by extension) the old media. It's partly because most economic incentives favor outrage over nuance. But another significant factor: it's cheaper to police others casually than to look inward at ourselves and take responsibility.

Kush

I'm with you on this one Colin. I think what both Kathy and Bill did was tasteless and in poor form. All of the negative criticism that they have received over that last little bit is even justified, but I hate when people seek to ruin a persons life over a mistake they have made. Even well thought out mistakes like Kathy's. I think the goal is to express your distaste for the persons actions without seeking to crucify them. You said something in your video that reminded me of a passage from the Bible. Colin, I know you're not a believer and I assume most people on this thread aren't, but when you were talking about how we all make mistakes, it reminded me of an incident that happened to Jesus one morning! “As he was speaking, the teachers of religious law and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in the act of adultery. They put her in front of the crowd. “Teacher,” they said to Jesus, “this woman was caught in the act of adultery. The law of Moses says to stone her. What do you say?” They were trying to trap him into saying something they could use against him, but Jesus stooped down and wrote in the dust with his finger. They kept demanding an answer, so he stood up again and said, “All right, but let the one who has never sinned throw the first stone!” Then he stooped down again and wrote in the dust. When the accusers heard this, they slipped away one by one, beginning with the oldest, until only Jesus was left in the middle of the crowd with the woman. Then Jesus stood up again and said to the woman, “Where are your accusers? Didn’t even one of them condemn you?” “No, Lord,” she said. And Jesus said, “Neither do I. Go and sin no more.” ‭‭John‬ ‭8:3-11‬ ‭NLT‬‬ No one knows for sure what Jesus was writing in the dust, but many scholars believe He was writing out the sins of the ladies accusers. Like this instant, I don't believe we should condone people's bad behavior. Point it out to them and let them know that what they did was wrong. But unless someone has committed a terrible crime that they need to answer for by the court of law, let's not seek to toss stones. Because like Colin said, this crazy Zombie horde could turn on any of us in an instant.

Fantastic Mr Scott

This is the exact thing I told people who tried to attack you about the tweet.

Jackson

No one hates Bill Mather more than me, but I had no problem with what he said. But Kathy Griffin is different, yes what she did was wrong, but her apology was a non apology, Bill Mahler was off the cuff, a quick reaction remark from a quick witted comedian, Kathy Griffin was WELL THOUHT out, WELL PLANNED, and she had plenty of time to think thing though before releasing that picture . She deserves everything she is getting.

What an eloquent video, Col. I'm tired of seeing people's outrage when people make mistakes. I watch Real Time, the joke was in very poor taste. But he "appleagized" the next day. Bill Maher, apologized for a joke he made. Bill Maher. You know he was sorry, because he doesn't do that. As to Kathy Griffin, yes, she fucked up. Also in very poor taste, but she apologized as well. I don't know why society has to do this to everybody. It just gets me a little peeved. Again, great video!

Khalil Sadi

Preaching from the decent and civil center - beautiful stuff! Thoroughly appreciated.

Steven Camilo

The forginess part is important on the story, if she would had double down. Then ok. If we can't forgive, them we all are screwed, it's only a matter of time before someone find something we regret or we so something we regret and we loose everything. Forgive and forget. It's a better way to live our life.

GrisWold Diablo

In a sense this whole escalation is a good thing. At work I was trained to fix problem before it got so big it would blow up in your face. This is what happen with politics & media in USA. Feels like Trump presidency is the blow up phase. We can't argue the problem wasn't already there. After the boom, hopefully the system can be rebuilt and maintained properly.

GrisWold Diablo

This is a problem "the left is coming to get you" if you listen to Bret from the Evergreen debacle, he his quite clear that the majority of the left is supportive of his position. Only the vocal/misinformed minority are against him. The left isn't there to get anyone, has a small group hijacked the narrative right now, I would say, yes. But they do not represent the majority on the left. Listen to this if you haven't yet, it's great, Joe Rogan on with Bret from Evergreen <a href="https://youtu.be/xq4Y87idawk" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://youtu.be/xq4Y87idawk</a>

GrisWold Diablo

I like Dave also, but when I see him post stuff that contradict each other it shows who he is ready to defends and attack, everytime he loose some of my respect. Take a look at @GriswoldDiablo's Tweet: <a href="https://twitter.com/GriswoldDiablo/status/870572128977932288?s=09" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://twitter.com/GriswoldDiablo/status/870572128977932288?s=09</a> I'll still be listening to his interview because he brings a great cast of diverse ideas.

GrisWold Diablo

Thanks for a reasonable response to these incidents, much needed. I've been a Bill Maher fan for a long time, watched over 10 seasons of Real Time, and try to see him live when he comes around. I appreciate him because he openly invites those he and his audience disagree with to his show and gives them an opportunity to speak and be heard (not without some banter though). I've changed my mind about a few of his conservative guests after hearing them on his show. I was pretty disappointed by his verbal fuck up, not because it convinced me that he is a racist who deserves a jobless, miserable life, but because it will turn others away from his show, in a year when he could have actually won more fans. Just like you, I don't agree with everything he says, but you know... I don't have to. We need more people willing to engage with those they don't immediately see eye-to-eye with (this is why I also like Dave Rubin so much). Keep up the good videos. You should do one about James Garfield. I recently visited Garfield's memorial and crypt in Cleveland. A self-made man with the strangest death story. Just an idea.

Think this one may hit a little too close to home to see what's going on here. Where I think you are correct about Bill Maur making a bad joke/comment being attacked is stupid, but Kathy Griffin was way out of line pissed off both sides and her press conference post apology did more damage where everyone felt the original was disingenuous. Maur is much more a victim of the left just like Collin. We are seeing them attack people who have championed their causes for years for being white now. Take a look at Evergreen college attacking the professors on campus for being white. You have to be 100% in no matter how ludicrous the demand or the left is coming to get you. Kathy Griffin is not in that boat she was out of line and had a press conference the crapped on her original apology.

James Galos

I've learned a lot fact-wise through your videos, Colin, but I've also repeatedly seen you highlight the importance of measured reactions, which I appreciate. These people did tasteless things, but certainly nothing to justify their personal and professional downfalls. I've faced issues like these at my job before; I work as a small-town newspaper reporter/editor, and a couple of years ago our former public works director called me up and politely asked if I would take down the stories we had run a few years earlier about some problems he had. He was stopped by the cops one night when he tried to drive drunk. They offered to arrange a ride home for him, and he said he'd walk home instead, and then he was arrested driving later that night by different cops. Apparently he was trying to get a job elsewhere and our stories were showing up on his background checks. I didn't take the stories down, a decision I stand by but still think about to this day.

Brent Lindquist

This is truth, Colin. It's very reminiscent of how the internet at large treated you over "the tweet" (which you mention). Keep fighting against bullshit. The Righteous Internet Machine will come for everyone.

I particularly agree with something you said torwards the end, hold elect officials accountable, people who have actual power over you. It's funny because it seems to me that the energy wasted with this character assasination of non-powerful people doesen't translate with politicians or even when it does through words it doesn't really seem to practically affect such people as demonstrated by the recent special election in Montana, just to make the first example that comes to my mind. Care a little more about what powerful people do and say since they directly affect you, and a little less about what comedians or non-powerful figures in general may say, do and think.

GabrieleEU

I found the Kathy Griffey thing tasteless, but think she is getting punished when this picture had to go through at least 5 people before it went to print. I'm not a fan of her but just thought the picture was a PR stunt that got way out of hand. Bill Maur who I like you enjoy but don't usually agree with but is always willing to apologize when he thinks he has done wrong and stand up for when he believes in what he says. This is a video that had to come from a person like you and happy you did it. Hope they both watch it and appreciate you standing up for them.

While I think the incident is disturbing...I highly doubt something like this could ever become the viral sensation that you speak of. Yes, it should be condemned, but if youngsters out there start holding dismembered heads of anyone...we've got some serious issues as a society that couldn't possibly be the fault of a comedian. And I also don't necessarily think ISIS needs a somewhat obscure, middle of the pack American comedian to validate their hatred and insanity. You're either into beheading and burning alive innocent human beings, or you aren't. I guess I'm saying if you are triggered into action by an event such as this, there have been horrors occurring and incubating within your mind and soul for quite some time. That being said I agree that the backlash against the photo doesn't seem to far fetched to me. Not sure what she really expected.

Zack E

I don't agree with what either of them did. I find both acts tasteless and kind of disgusting. That said, I agree with you. They both apologized for making mistakes and we should move on. I don't think either of them should have their careers ruined for what they did. Keep up the good work my man.

Dan Phillips

Another excellent video and one from the heart , what good is freedom of expression in words if people go hunting all the time. From these sometimes extreme words or jokes within them lies the hypocrisy of our alleged accepting and modern society . From them we should look inward and constantly reassess our positions . Thank you again for the fabulous and thought provoking content , thank goodness, for CLS😊

George Newton

With Bill Maher, I do believe context matters and if he felt he needed to apologize right after and that is what he did then that is where it should end. But again, as long as it was his decision as context and situation also plays a role in comedy, which is always subjective. As for Kathy Griffin, I did lose sympathy for her with the video where she clearly showed she understood that there was going to be backlash and was almost gleefully looking forward to it. That is where she lost her ground, especially with anyone with a moral compass could see the image was tasteless and taken to get attention from all sides. Her non-apology press conference just furthered that lost ground as she deflected blame. She should've stuck to the content of her original apology video, which was much better, and not try to bury others. I don't think she should be harmed or face jail time for the picture but as a public figure that represented brands, those brands do have the choice if they want to continue their partnership if they see Griffin's image hurting what their brand stands for.

Kevin Lainez

You made a good argument for Griffin and given your recent experiences, I understand your position. However, I respectfully disagree with you. Nobody has talked about Griffin in 20 years or so and now everybody is, she got exactly what she was looking for - publicity. I can't find any artistic value in the photo as you proposed. I'm glad she is getting the backlash which I feel is well deserved. If people are accepting of this, the ISIS-inspired behavior could become the next "planking" or "ice bucket challenge". No thanks. You'd have to think that ISIS members themselves are given validation and renewed energy seeing the photos. If people in her industry never forgive her (which I doubt), I think she'll still be fine. The backlash truly serves as a message to others that this type of behavior is not tolerable.

four24twenty

I think there has to be consequences for your actions, and we also have to consider why people apologise. Are they sorry because they know it was wrong, or are they sorry because they've been shamed into being so. But this is the culture we live in. And we must move away from being a shame culture and back into being a guilt culture. Where people feel bad because they know they've done something wrong, not because they've been seen to be doing something wrong.

Samuel

The political language used to attack Bill Clinton, escalated to attack Bush, escalated to defeat Obama, escalated bigly to try to destroy Trump. The next democrat president better bring a fucking poncho, because now that the bet's been raised, the next guy will face a shitstorm.

Jeremy Meyer

The liberal biology professor at Evergreen, etc... If the left keeps eating its own, how will democrats ever take back the house, senate, and white house, and build a governing coalition that last more than 1 week?

Jeremy Meyer

The pushback is tribal warfare. Good people are trying to hold the line. "Give these people nothing. Take from them, everything."

Jeremy Meyer

I am alittle confused Colin when you say that the back lash is completely over the top when someone makes a mistake but its not necessarily a pattern for that person...yet you talked just a few minutes before that Kathy Griffin does have a pattern for this sort of stuff, you even gave examples of her going too far before. I totally understand that people make mistakes but if you watch the video of Kathy Griffin doing the photo shoot, high fiving the camera man when she sees the photos for the first time and joking about moving to Mexico...does that sound like a mistake or a deliberate act? I dont want Kathy Griffin to go to jail or be harmed, I just dont really think the backlash to her has been ridiculous, she held up a SEVERED head of a sitting president. Why? What statement does that make? What 'artistic expression' does that show? Dont you think it is totally legitimate for company to pull away from someone who can rationalize the thought of doing a whole photo shoot to hold up a person’s head all bloody? Don’t you think its legitimate for other people to call it vile, gross and sick? I do think many times the back lash is out of control and unnecessary, you, Bret Weinstein and Sam Harris come to mind, but I find it hard to defend the idea that the back lash for Kathy is unwarranted? Seems to be watering down and basically saying that no matter what anyone does there shouldn't be consequences or any reactions. I guess the big thing I have trouble with is rationalizing that what you did, in the tweet, and the media calling it racist (which is 100% was not) and what Kathy Griffin did, and the media calling it disgusting (which it 100% was), are the same thing.

Seth Eden

The people "outraged" over The Tweet ("Ah, collective liberal freakout. #a day without a moral center...) are the same people celebrating the mob desire for Trump to be beheaded.

Jeremy Meyer

2005 Sarah Silverman, back when she was young and hot, could have pulled it off. 2017 Sarah Silverman, not so much. Rosario Dawson, I'd give her a pass if she did much worse.

Jeremy Meyer

"Looks like an ISIS video. Talks like an ISIS video. Nope, just a fame whore." was my first reaction. But I bet Trey Parker and Matt Stone could have gotten away with it.

Jeremy Meyer

Fantastic post. I truly believe people love watching others fall because of their own self hatred. I think Harvey Dent said it best “You Either Die A Hero, Or You Live Long Enough To See Yourself Become The Villain”.

Joey Finelli

I think, to the general topic of why we do this to each other, unfortunately we've become a culture that values, well, humiliation as a form of discourse. It's no longer enough to win an argument or prevail in politics. Now a victory is not complete unless the other guy is made to be completely submissive in defeat (commonly best described in urban slang I find a bit sexist). As long as both sides of any debate or conflict fear that the cost of defeat will be indefinite &amp; on-going humiliation, the temptation to "get the other guy before he gets me" will continue. Regarding Bill Maher specifically, I agree that as with all things "politically correct", the outrage against him is overblown. However, as a Liberal AND a Black man I'm also conflicted in dealing with his brand of comedy. He's without doubt a major and important voice for Liberalism and has been for decades. However I'm also uncomfortable with how readily he engages in stereotypes of Black culture to gives his jokes "street cred". This is likely the context in which he used the "n-word" on his show, but it's part of a larger pattern. In particular, he often uses the type of slang most often associated with the most negative aspects of Black culture, aka, "gansta". He would regularly opine about how Obama, as president, should "go gangsta" on Republicans to get them to go along with his policy agenda, and would often imply that Obama's normally cool, respectable demeanor was actually a thin facade over a more, how shall we say, Samuel L. Jackson approach; the "angry black man". This, I believe, often played into some Conservative beliefs regarding Blacks; that most of us really are the strutting, vulgar, violent characters from a rap video and not much else. While Maher played this for laughs, this is also the kind of pre-conception of Black culture that gets people like Jordan Davis or Tamir Rice killed. While I would never suggest that Maher, or even most Conservative pundits, be summarily fired for their commentary, I wish they all would sometimes take a step back and consider the larger context of their discourse.

Stephen J Seidler

I'm not sure I agree with your opinion on Cathy Griffin. The difference between her and Bill Maher is there's a deep rooted truth to what Cathy Griffin did. Some part of her thinks that a severed Donald Trump head would be a good thing for America. That's how much people hate Trump and it's absolutely disgusting. Bill Maher made a joke, a tasteless joke, but is far from being a racist. You made a silly joke about about women talking too much. What happened to you and Bill Maher was indeed a witch hunt because you're far from what you're accused of. I'm not so sure about Cathy Griffin...

Dylan Manuszak