KnockBack, Episode 33: Calvin and Hobbes
Added 2018-09-27 16:00:03 +0000 UTCFrom late 1985 until the very end of 1995, immensely talented artist Bill Watterson produced Calvin and Hobbes, a beloved comic strip all about a young boy and his imaginary tiger friend. During the decade it ran -- and in the decades since -- Calvin and Hobbes has touched millions, but even more fascinating than the strip itself is the reclusive man who made it, a man who voluntarily walked away from it all and refused to capitalize on the potential, untold success of his creation. Today's KnockBack is dedicated not only to Watterson's seminal work of art, but to his story. Indeed, this episode circulates around a single theme: If it's okay to sell out.
Comments
Col, surprised to hear you think The Catcher In the Rye is overrated. I think the writing of Holden is timeless.
NeO JD
2022-07-25 07:57:20 +0000 UTCLove to hear the love for the Calvin and Hobbes comic and the discussion about Bill Watterson the man. I was surprised to hear how hard you were on Watterson, a position that I feel you jumped to too quickly and far too harshly. Context would probably help a great deal in that regard and here are a couple points. Early in the strips life the publisher put extreme pressure on Watterson regarding merchandising and licensing citing the contract he signed actually gave them the rights to do anything they wanted with Calvin and Hobbes up to and including firing Watterson and hiring someone else to write the strip. Lucky for all of us, he was able to renegotiate the contract and we saw another five years of comics before he called it quits for good. The unauthorized merchandise that started showing up proved to be another legal problem, which he attended to fight, but the bootlegs were notoriously difficult to track down and prosecute. This ultimately ended up demoralizing Watterson. Ultimately, losing that fight is probably the real reason we never saw much in the way of authorized merchandise. This all left a bitter taste and he developed a strong mistrust in anyone wanting to license the product. He was very critical of people like Jim Davis (Garfield) but praised people like Charles Schulz (Peanuts) over the integrity of the work. Schulz, even at his advanced age, never hired ghost writers while Jim Davis hasn’t drawn Garfield for decades. The main takeaway here is that he did try do some limited amount of merchandising on his terms. Unfortunately for all of us, no one would accept his terms, so we have very little authorized merchandise. This is precisely what you criticized him for in the episode and I think it’s important to know that he tried to do it right but was unable to at the time. Perhaps he didn’t know the right people or had bad representation. For whatever reason, it never panned out. With ending the strip, it wasn’t about walking away from the money either. He knew the strip was on top and beloved by people. He had done a daily strip for ten years and was having a legitimately difficult time keeping the quality where he wanted it. He was tired and wanted to move on. If you’re looking for a high-profile parallel, you can think of it the same way you think of the end of Seinfeld. Why milk it for years, knowing that it will start to decline when you can go out on top? Watterson already made his money and, by all accounts, lives a quiet, comfortable, life. He does keep a low-profile which is another thing that I respect. Here again there is a parallel to be drawn with artists like Daft Punk. It seems like a good artistic decision to let the work stand on its own instead of muddying the waters with your own personal image. A lesson that many modern artists, actors, and musicians should learn. Marketing efforts to the contrary may work on lots of people but it has the opposite effect for me. As a side note, you may recall that Jerry Seinfeld kept a low-profile for several years after the end of the show. The last parallel I’ll draw is what happened with Star Wars and George Lucas. Not that anything that severe would have happened but I can only imagine what might have happened had licensing and merchandising gone horribly wrong. As near as I can tell, Watterson did what was best for him and what was best for Calvin and Hobbes. He certainly left a lot of money on the table but we’re all better off for it.
Wag
2018-10-07 06:06:11 +0000 UTCDude, what the fuck even is Cathy. Sadly, I started reading a bit about it after I edited this episode, and as far as I can tell, it was supposed to be for 20 and 30-something professional women.
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-06 04:46:01 +0000 UTCGreat episode. It's fun to hear Dagen's passion about Calvin & Hobbes. I need to pick up some of the collections after listening to this episode. I haven't read it since I was a kid. And can we agree that Cathy and Family Circus are the worst comics ever?
Francis Bryan
2018-10-05 00:09:31 +0000 UTCOh yes, who could forget the legendary arcade, "Time Out"?!
Joseph Ady
2018-10-04 23:03:53 +0000 UTCIt's really hard to write this in a balanced way, but you do come off as a A Rand disciple, where anything that isn't all about money is odd to you. Which is why this guys choice infuriates you. "Why isn't he making as much as he can and taking this opportunity?" Sometimes it's not about the money and some people reach a point where they are happy with what they have (financially and arts wise)
Wesley
2018-10-04 20:11:48 +0000 UTCThat's a cop-out, though, because he could be as deliberate as he wanted, instead of writing it all off. I simply don't see his angle.
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-04 19:56:00 +0000 UTCLOL. I loved Smithhaven Mall.
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-04 19:55:35 +0000 UTCI think Bill was simply against making everything comercial. You've just spent an hour talking about the quality and love hes put into this medium. He could not guarantee this is what would happen with merchandise. I can greatly respect someone who isn't trying to sqeeze every dollar out if something. What is merchandising acheving exactly.
Wesley
2018-10-04 19:13:32 +0000 UTCI remember I stole multiple calvin and hobbes book from a book store (Walden books?) in the Smithaven mall. They were really good.
Joseph Ady
2018-10-04 16:16:51 +0000 UTCI respect that he didn't want to do it anymore. He can do whatever he wants. I don't respect his tact.
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-02 19:55:49 +0000 UTCThat's doable, though perhaps not granular enough. We'll see. =)
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-02 19:55:31 +0000 UTCThere's much we didn't mention, I suspect!
Colin Moriarty
2018-10-02 19:55:22 +0000 UTCI know i'm late to this post, but man it really got me into the comic, i'm gonna buy the collected edition when i get a chance. One of the interesting things i read about Watterson was that in 2010 he said something along the lines that, he didn't regret ending the comic because he didn't want to keep it going to the point where people were tired of it, which is something i'm afraid Star Wars might be going through, and also he said that he wanted to make way for up-and-comers to take his place.
Kenneth Oms
2018-10-02 18:10:11 +0000 UTCHaven't had a chance to listen yet, but intend to this weekend. Have you thought about a Disney Afternoon Knockback? Or have you sort of discussed elsewhere?
Josh James
2018-09-29 19:58:46 +0000 UTCI’m surprised Dagan didn’t mention that the names Calvin and Hobbes came from philosophers John Calvin and Thomas Hobbes, which is where the philosophical angle came from
Tyson Williams
2018-09-29 04:05:31 +0000 UTCIn that case, you fucked up.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-29 00:52:39 +0000 UTCWell, that is a fun fact!
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-29 00:52:26 +0000 UTCGlad to hear that! Sounds like Dagan and his son are sharing a common bond.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-29 00:52:20 +0000 UTCI accidentally stole a Calvin and Hobbes book from my third grade teacher. She let me take it home and I never remembered to bring it back. I still have it in a box somewhere. Also, I broke out my old yearbook a while back, and it took me being a grown adult to realize that the aforementioned teacher was extremely hot. Anyway, great episode, guys. I learned a lot about C&H that I didn’t know. Have a good day!
Ian (616Entertainment)
2018-09-28 23:58:52 +0000 UTCFun fact! Waterson grew up in Chagrin Falls Ohio, a suburb of Cleveland. And Hobbes is based off of the Chagrin Falls Highschool mascot, the Tigers. My parents live there!
DeucesBruh
2018-09-28 22:54:43 +0000 UTCMy dad grew up with Calvin and Hobbes and so we always had the compilation books in the house and we all loved them, especially me and my dad
Tyson Williams
2018-09-28 20:47:03 +0000 UTCThat’s totally fair, maybe I’m just getting to hung up on the example of super rich athletes. I understand people getting frustrated at quality being sacrificed at money, but I will never begrudge someone for maximising their earnings. I don’t have an artistic bone in my body though so my opinion on it isn’t worth too much!
Keith Farrell
2018-09-28 19:59:54 +0000 UTCI honestly don't think there's a lone definition of "selling out," but it's certainly used disparagingly when people want to make a living off of their craft.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-28 19:49:20 +0000 UTCFun episode, even though I had never heard of it before! Can hear Dagan’s passion for it. Btw I think you are maybe misinterpreting what people mean by sell-out. Where I’m from at least, a sell-out is someone who sacrifices quality, creative control or opportunities of accomplishments simply for a monetary gain. Of course, people can do what they want, but a lot of people instinctively look down on something like a soccer player who is in his prime at a great team, who moves to some unknown almost amateur level club in Russia or China (likely owned by some Oligarch)... sacrificing all chances of meaningful accomplishments in the sport, for a pay raise. Again, if money is their only concern then that’s fair enough but people will inherently brand them a sell-out
Keith Farrell
2018-09-28 14:27:21 +0000 UTCThank you for the recommendation! I will check it out.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-28 05:23:42 +0000 UTCTerrible book. =D
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-28 05:23:26 +0000 UTCNoted! =)
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-28 05:23:19 +0000 UTCGreat episode! Ya’ll slid in the bit about Bam and Jackass... I need this episode almost as much as I need air
Blake Davis
2018-09-28 04:08:32 +0000 UTCSidebar: I also FUCKING HATE Grapes of Wrath. Had to read it in High School. Hated it. An entire chapter. About a turtle. Crossing a road. Painstakingly described, its setbacks and struggles symbolizing the struggles of the Joad family and other farmers during the dust bowl. An entire chapter! Fuck you, Steinbeck.
Nate McKinney
2018-09-28 03:42:57 +0000 UTCLove love LOOOOVE me some Edgar Allen Poe. The Cask of Amontillado is one of my favorites, read it in freshman English class in high school, it has stuck with me ever since. It's an amazing revenge story. It's chilling. I highly recommend it if you haven't read it, Colin. Newspaper comics were a big part of my childhood as well. I had a phase where I really loved them. (Garfield was always my favorite.) Ironically enough, I'm editing a comics page at work right now! (I work at a newspaper.)
Nate McKinney
2018-09-28 02:57:29 +0000 UTC=) =) =)
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 22:41:13 +0000 UTCOoooooo! Saving this for when I get home from work tonight!!
Jeff Pollard
2018-09-27 22:25:08 +0000 UTCIt's advice I need to take to heart once in a while.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:45:08 +0000 UTCI'll look into it. Thanks!
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:44:57 +0000 UTCDagan talks about it on this episode!
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:44:11 +0000 UTCThat's part of the fun of this show. =D
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:44:04 +0000 UTCThanks, although I think Dagan deserves his fair share of the credit, too. =D
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:43:57 +0000 UTCDagan would agree!
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:43:42 +0000 UTCThis is all Dagan! Hope you enjoy.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:43:34 +0000 UTCIt sounds like it'll never happen, though. =\
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:43:27 +0000 UTCI hope you enjoy! This episode is a bit different, I think. In a good way.
Colin Moriarty
2018-09-27 21:43:15 +0000 UTC"We're so busy watching out for what's just ahead of us that we don't take the time to enjoy where we are"
Kenny Gutzler
2018-09-27 19:31:40 +0000 UTCColin if you wanna dive deep into a random crazy story read the wiki on hank ketcham who wrote and drew Dennis the Menace.<a href="https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hank_Ketcham" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hank_Ketcham</a>
Matthew Clarkson
2018-09-27 19:19:07 +0000 UTCCan't wait to listen, this was a huge part of my childhood, I assume y'all have seen the doc?
David Kramme
2018-09-27 18:20:48 +0000 UTCThis must be out of my age demo because I have no idea what this is lol
Zack E
2018-09-27 17:10:31 +0000 UTCOMG. My favorite strip of all time! (Followed by The Farside). I had no idea you guys were doing a Knockback on this one! Too cool. Colin, I know you and Dagan are a team, but you're the mastermind of all this. I freaking love you.
Jason Stafford
2018-09-27 16:31:22 +0000 UTCCalvin and Hobbes is great. One of the greatest, most charming, and insightful comic strips.
Blair Sutton
2018-09-27 16:29:07 +0000 UTCMy favorite comic strip of all time ... Can't wait to hear both of your takes on this one.
Matt Styka
2018-09-27 16:09:49 +0000 UTCThis and captain underpants used to be the only thing I read. I saw the captain underpants movie, it was p good! A Calvin and Hobbes movie isn’t necessary but would make me happy
Caleb Peacock
2018-09-27 16:06:42 +0000 UTCOMG my hype for this episode is through the roof!! My steam avatar has been Calvin and Hobbes making a funny face for at least 10 years.
ScootyTooty
2018-09-27 16:03:30 +0000 UTC
