KnockBack, Episode 220 | Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith
Added 2022-04-25 16:00:09 +0000 UTCOur slow-and-steady voyage through the Star Wars films continues unabated this week, as we move our focus to 2005's Episode III: Revenge of the Sith (as voted on by our listeners on Patreon). Capping off a tumultuous and ill-received prequel trilogy, Episode III is widely considered the strongest effort in that specific arc. But do we, The Brothers Moriarty, agree? Not particularly. Revenge of the Sith was when Lucas ran out of runway, and as a result, we're met with a rushed film that sets the seeds of some good ideas, but barely sticks around long enough to see any of them grow. Worse yet, it ignores much of what would have made this movie shine, adding too much to a concoction already drowning in watered-down ingredients. Before you execute Order 66, however, consider giving our chat a listen, and discover what a couple of lapsed, curmudgeonly Star Wars fans think about Anakin's ultimate turn to the Dark Side.
Comments
I think Dagan's right about context I watched Sith several times growing up always thinking it didn't feel right but I find myself a bit more forgiving and entertained by it knowing how much spun-off from it (The Siege of Mandalore Arc in CW season 7, the Obi-wan miniseries, the Darth Plagueis novel, etc.)
MikeLee
2022-05-11 22:48:48 +0000 UTCAll good! I cheered you guys on when you tore down the sequels, so you gotta be able to take criticism on the other side 👍 OG trilogy while not as memeable is still top dog
MeatSpin11
2022-05-03 23:11:56 +0000 UTCI'm sorry. =\
Colin Moriarty
2022-05-03 22:05:27 +0000 UTCOh dear.
Colin Moriarty
2022-05-03 22:05:22 +0000 UTCAs a ‘94 born millennial that loved the prequels, this episode hurt a bit lol. Still enjoyed though and can see why you guys feel how you feel.
MeatSpin11
2022-05-03 19:14:06 +0000 UTCColin, fun fact: jar-jar actually has one speaking line in this film, it’s “excuse me”, which I simply interpret as an apology to the audience from George.
Kid-Organic
2022-05-02 23:43:44 +0000 UTCAction figure.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-30 02:42:45 +0000 UTCA canon reason for why this wouldnt happen is the so called Sith "rule of two". Sidious wouldn't have allowed this due to his commitment to the code passed on to him where there can only be two Sith at a time. Though the inquisitors which were introduced by Disney make that a little fuzzier.
Tyran Batten
2022-04-29 03:29:19 +0000 UTCI'm 24 and don't like this movie very much. I like it more than I, II, and IX but that's it. It has its cool stuff but it's overall dull and rushed. I also hate Grevious too.
Michael (ObjoGaming)
2022-04-28 23:55:51 +0000 UTCIt's interesting!
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:06:23 +0000 UTCI played both, but long ago.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:06:18 +0000 UTCIndeed.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:06:13 +0000 UTCI couldn't imagine how anyone can watch Episode III and think it matches literally anything from the originals.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:06:10 +0000 UTCWe'd love to do that.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:05:50 +0000 UTCHow can that be? I'd like to learn more about this.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:05:44 +0000 UTCI'm not interested in content that's truly required to make other content better.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-28 15:05:31 +0000 UTCMan how some of these write ins list this as their favourite star wars movie is so confusing to me... like how? Amazing episode tho, you two breakdown these films so well.
Reuben Barrett
2022-04-28 01:50:05 +0000 UTCIf you guys haven't played Knight of the Old Republic 1 and 2 they touch on alot about the blurred lines between Jedi and Sith. Your conversation about the light and dark just made me think about the events, characters and philosophies of those games and how the movies have alot of catching up to do in my opinion. Here's a quote from one of the greatest Jedi ever written, Jolee Bindo; Love doesn't lead to the dark side. Passion can lead to rage and fear, and can be controlled, but passion is not the same thing as love. Controlling your passions while being in love, that's what they should teach you to beware, but love itself will save you, not condemn you
Carlos Moreno
2022-04-27 12:19:35 +0000 UTCWouldn’t it make more sense for vader to recruit the younglings to the sith instead of slaughtering them? An army of impressionable, future sith lords seems pretty valuable but I’m not George Lucas I guess lol
GameSimp
2022-04-27 11:47:23 +0000 UTCThe generation thing is definitely a factor in your opinion on prequels. While most younger millennials (I’m born 1994) like the prequels enough I think most also would say nothing beats the original trilogy. I know I feel that way.
Joseph Losinno
2022-04-27 03:45:54 +0000 UTCJust a side note I listened to the TMNT episode of Knockback last night. Great episode definitely feel like you guys should revisit the first and second live action movies again. As for myself even though I was the perfect age when the prequel trilogy first came out in theaters I was about 11 or 12 when episode one came out. For me my first experience with Star Wars was the original trilogy when I first watched it on VHS special edition collection with Darth Vader’s face on the box. To me episode one was good but after watching episode two in the theater I knew they fucked up bad. I’m just glad I experienced the original trilogy and that became my first introduction to the magic of Star Wars.
Josh Correa
2022-04-27 00:36:56 +0000 UTCIn regards to the discussion about the use/overuse of CG in the prequels, I just wanted to bring up that the prequels actually have more practical effects than the entire original trilogy. Just a fun fact other than that great episode as always Collin!
KiteAsHigh
2022-04-26 20:21:06 +0000 UTCSo many questions, frustrations, or concerns about a lacking robust story were solved with Filoni and his many shows. The Clone Wars does so much to fix The Prequels and make them fit into the world better. While they might not "fix" them entirely for you there is a lot of love and thought put into making The Prequels a more thought out and robust story that gives proper resolution and story progression into the later movies. Filoni knew what the problems with the movies were but he found a way to help solve them. The biggest being Anakin's arc. That arc from light to dark is so well done in the show. By the final season, you get such a better understanding of his distrust and hatred for The Jedi Council. I know Colin would likely never want to sit through that much content to experience it all but the final season of The Clone Wars does such a service to Ep 3. There is a fan edit of the final season and Ep 3 cut as one long movie that is awesome. The issue is the first season is pretty throw away so you really need to just get season 1 and the animated movie out of the way to get to season 2. That's when stuff gets good.
Trevor Deal
2022-04-26 16:20:11 +0000 UTCI will not do it.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:56 +0000 UTCIndeed.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:52 +0000 UTC?
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:32 +0000 UTCMy list constantly changes.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:27 +0000 UTCI think it's an age thing, too.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:21 +0000 UTCIt's very interesting to think about. I think it all goes back to Lucas tying up the licensing and IP completely. Very smart.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:14:15 +0000 UTCNo!!!
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:59 +0000 UTCEnjoy. =)
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:47 +0000 UTCThat's what you think.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:43 +0000 UTCNo, but I will.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:38 +0000 UTCNo!!!
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:33 +0000 UTCI was... hm... 13, 17, and 21?
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-26 16:13:29 +0000 UTCI definitely recommend watching the clone wars animated series! It was made by a man who hated the prequels and wanted to work with George Lucas to make anakins fall to the dark side and fill in the very gaps you complained about in this episode
Captain Bon Clay
2022-04-26 15:55:39 +0000 UTCYeah whenever they talk About basically anything Star Wars that's not the original trilogy it comes across kinda Gate Kepperish. These episodes are honestly a great example of the idea that nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans lol.
Josh Gamez
2022-04-26 13:55:21 +0000 UTCI feel pretty lucky that I saw this as a kid, I really enjoy watching this film now due to nostalgia. If I was older I’m sure our view would be more similar
Martyn Bridge
2022-04-26 13:15:40 +0000 UTCI know the guys are all about the original trilogy but why do they care so much that people like the prequel. I have a lot of love for them because I was young when they came out. Just like a lot of kids are going to grow up loving the sequels. It's just made for a different audience.
Thorman
2022-04-26 11:55:48 +0000 UTC“What about all the other Jedi spread out across the galaxy?” Comedy gold
Joshua Brown
2022-04-26 09:00:30 +0000 UTCI think 3 is just ok. I have it ranked 7/11 on my list.
NeO JD
2022-04-26 08:50:15 +0000 UTCMan I gotta say I completely disagree with a lot of what you guys said but I think that’s because of my age. I grew up with the prequel movies and they are my Star Wars as the OG trilogy is to you guys. Perhaps it’s a generational thing.
Rick the Turnip
2022-04-26 02:42:26 +0000 UTCI thought so until they mentioned not caring about the politics/setting, you’d have to in order to enjoy it I think.
Noah Friscopp
2022-04-25 22:48:25 +0000 UTCStars Wars will always be a complicated mess. When the creator’s own vison isn’t good, then other people try their own thing, THAT isn’t good either; Makes you wonder how this series survived, especially after the Christmas Special.
Brandon Soto
2022-04-25 22:37:59 +0000 UTCGotta request you guys to watch the animated clone wars. That series gives way more understanding of the decisions in the prequels. Knockback makes my work day flow by
Brandon H
2022-04-25 21:03:18 +0000 UTCMan hearing you talk about how these prequel characters should‘ve been utilized makes me think you’d really dig Clone Wars. It’s a lot though I know. I will say though, Clone Wars is full of filler episodes that don’t need to be watched. It’s more of an anthology covering different parts of the war. There are guides out there that tell you which episodes to watch to get the main gist of the story and it ends up not being TOO many episodes.
Bogey
2022-04-25 19:56:05 +0000 UTCMaking Mondays great! Stoked to listen!
yosh_wah
2022-04-25 19:49:44 +0000 UTCI GOT THE HIGH GROUND
KomakiKhaos
2022-04-25 19:17:57 +0000 UTCColin, Have you looked into the Tesla Powerwall?
Al Rodriguez
2022-04-25 18:41:04 +0000 UTCGreat conversation, and yes please watch at least the Clone Wars microseries it is sooo good.
Noah Friscopp
2022-04-25 18:40:04 +0000 UTCI was 8, 11, and 14 when each of the prequels came out and I absolutely despise them. I will never understand the love for these movies. They have so many issues and problems and make plot holes for future movies like her remembering her mom. I could go on and on but I'm glad others enjoy these movies and would never tell someone they're wrong for enjoying them but I'd take any of the disney movies over the prequels.
thefury4815
2022-04-25 18:15:35 +0000 UTCHahahaha no its not.
Frank G.
2022-04-25 17:46:48 +0000 UTCSolo is so much better than this!!!
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:46:29 +0000 UTCOh man, I bet they do.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:46:13 +0000 UTC=)
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:46:05 +0000 UTCThis all happens in 20 years?
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:46:02 +0000 UTCLimp Bizkit.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:45:49 +0000 UTCYou would think that.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:45:43 +0000 UTC=\
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:45:38 +0000 UTCYes.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 17:45:34 +0000 UTCAbsolutely my favorite ( even with all the memes) can't wait for obi Wan to continue the story from there. I've always thought how dope it was to close the gap on a story on a tragic note and I remember my friends and I being like well Star Wars is done cool everyone dies and Luke's gonna save the galaxy. A simpler time that's been bastardized by Disney today no doubt. But at least the prequels had storyline it followed and thanks to the team that Refused! to listen to every single thing George Lucas wanted in episode 3. We got the infamous and tragic conclusion that well he always envisioned. This goes to show the sequel trilogy should of at least tried consulting with Lucas and it wouldn't of ended 😒 as it did. I also love how Rogue One compliments this story a bit how dire shit was between 3 and 4 everyone in hiding plotting to get back at the empire. Hero takes down big bad empire story been told 1000 times but Star Wars made it famous for better or worse, but for me this always stand out. As a sore ass thumb to some lol but nothings worse that episode 2 (should of been a tv show, oh that's right) if Kingdom Hearts fans can defend THAT! well I can defend this. I haven't heard the podcast yet so let's see how much the Moriarty bros took the rewatch😅. By the way thank you for giving it a chance I know the old school fans hate this one, but if I had to deal with SOLO you guys can handle this.
Frank G.
2022-04-25 17:39:21 +0000 UTCThey do use that exact “WAR!” Voice in the clone wars tv show 😭. Grievous is dope in his first appearance and the novel version of this is superior
Markeus
2022-04-25 17:24:58 +0000 UTCI don't underestimate your power!
Max Stahl
2022-04-25 17:18:30 +0000 UTCOkay I gotta say y’all are dead wrong in the tech regression not making sense. The whole point of the republic is that it is bloated and at the beginning of its fall. You see the predecessors to the star destroyers, x-wings, y-wings, and speeder bikes in this film. The empire sent the galaxy into a depression under its fascist rule so the “golden-age” kind of tech became rarer while simpler and cheaper tech rose in prominence. The empire wanted to ERASE the republic and the confederacy so it replaced and removed the tech from their military forces. Similar to how they used actual recruits instead of clones or battle droids since the empire believed it was a better way to hold control over the galaxy. The movie has problems but the tech and world building is definitely not one of them
TexasTaterSalad
2022-04-25 17:17:04 +0000 UTCWe need a Biscuit the hamster animated short by dagan
Kenneth Oms
2022-04-25 16:59:57 +0000 UTCFrom my point of view, Revenge of the Sith is better than Return of the Jedi
Steve Forgione
2022-04-25 16:52:07 +0000 UTCHot damn. Can’t wait to relieve Colin’s adoration for the Yoda vs. Palpatine fight. 🙃
Paul Waltz
2022-04-25 16:51:47 +0000 UTC… This is where the fun begins
Noah Friscopp
2022-04-25 16:41:04 +0000 UTCOh yes.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 16:39:43 +0000 UTCthis is gonna be good
GJ
2022-04-25 16:36:43 +0000 UTCEnjoy!
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 16:36:41 +0000 UTC<3
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 16:36:38 +0000 UTCIt was fine. I don't think I had even seen it since 2005.
Colin Moriarty
2022-04-25 16:36:36 +0000 UTCOh boy. I'm sorry you had to subject yourself to this, for us. Brave and stunning.
Alex Bolton
2022-04-25 16:09:52 +0000 UTCLols. My favourite knockbacks!
Phil Walker
2022-04-25 16:08:19 +0000 UTCBeen waiting for this one. Super excited to finish this part of the series! 😁
Tim J Weckwerth
2022-04-25 16:02:24 +0000 UTC
