KnockBack, Episode 106 | Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens
Added 2020-02-20 17:00:04 +0000 UTCThe infamous Prequel Trilogy of Star Wars films left a bad taste in many enthusiasts' mouths, particularly those who have been fans of the space opera franchise going back to the '70s and '80s. That's why it was so amazingly exciting when -- in 2015 -- Star Wars appeared primed to return to form with a JJ Abrams-led movie that had the entire galaxy eager to see what happens next. The result was something safe, but solid, with a returning cast of familiar faces joined by a new generation of rebels, imperials, pilots, scoundrels, and would-be Jedi. Join us for a discussion (nearly twice as long as the movie itself!) about the ins and outs of the plot, characters, worlds, and more than make The Force Awakens tick... and why it's perhaps the greatest shame of all that such a promising start to something new was quickly squandered only a couple of short years later.
Comments
I pulled over and signed into Patreon JUST to comment about how much I absolutely fucking HHHHHHHHHHHHHATE Episode 2, we went back through the prequel trilogy this year just because Rei was so young when it came out she didn't remember them. Episode 1 to me was still 'fine' some things I disliked, but I was okay with it but sweet fucking baby Jesus I don't know how Episode 2 managed to be horrible in my memory and then somehow get SIGNIFICANTLY WORSE when we watched it..... Fffffffffffffffuck, bring on the KnockBack episode on that one so I can bathe in the hatred I need to hear from you gents on that garbage pile of ffffff Okay, this episode was great btw! Heading to get some pizza with my best friend and watch a random movie. Love you guys 🤔😘
Lou & Rei Loper
2020-03-05 23:05:26 +0000 UTCHey Cory, thank you for your feedback! I thought we were pretty positive on this episode, personally. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-03-05 21:10:17 +0000 UTCI know and understand that one of the primary objectives of the show is to talk about nostalgic things warts and all but I am not exactly looking forward to any more Star Wars related shows anytime soon, particularly Episode 8. I find the show to be at its very best when you and Dagan are able to speak enthusiastically about things and would prefer more music talk, more animation history, seminal games/movies and more childhood memories over more Star Wars. I wish I could leave a video message of this sentiment because I’m not mad or disappointed that Star Wars is covered. I simply just enjoy the other content a lot more. Cheers and thanks for the great show, Colin & Dagan.
Cory Hahn
2020-03-04 18:08:19 +0000 UTClol it happens
Karan D
2020-03-03 22:10:18 +0000 UTCWow, nostalgic for The Force Awakens! I am getting old. =\
Colin Moriarty
2020-03-03 20:20:51 +0000 UTCI may be a little late but I can't wait for to hear this! This is probably the Star Wars film I'm most nostalgic for since I was 16 when it came out (I'm born in '99 btw). meaning I had the perfect blend of nostalgia for the older films and child like excitement for a new Star Wars film.
Karan D
2020-02-29 20:50:30 +0000 UTCInteresting point.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-28 01:55:53 +0000 UTCPerhaps you're right.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-28 01:55:43 +0000 UTCInteresting!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-28 01:55:38 +0000 UTCShoutout!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-28 01:55:34 +0000 UTC<3
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-28 01:55:29 +0000 UTCComparing The Last Jedi to a turd is still more praise than that movie deserves. Great episode guys!
Ryan Basyooni
2020-02-28 00:26:49 +0000 UTCFavorite Star Wars movie by an absolute mile.
DS-616
2020-02-27 18:20:59 +0000 UTCClone Wars bored me to tears. And the robot animation style is laughably bad.
DS-616
2020-02-27 18:18:55 +0000 UTCDon't factually act like a man-child and no one will rightfully call you a man-child. It's really not rocket science. P.S. The way George Lucas treated the franchise objectively a thousand times worse with the prequels didn't get you to stop supporting Star Wars but the infinitely superior sequel movies did? LOL ok 👌🏻
DS-616
2020-02-27 18:17:40 +0000 UTC@JEECE Because It *was* good, douchebag. But keep being a delusional, nostalgia ridden man-child laughably overpraising the painfully flawed original trilogy.
DS-616
2020-02-27 18:09:55 +0000 UTCLOL did not expect to hear the Moriarty brothers to mention me by name on this episode.
Mikey 12
2020-02-27 17:31:35 +0000 UTCSo happy !!!! Listening now
A Hind D
2020-02-27 17:27:52 +0000 UTCThank you for listening!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 16:01:00 +0000 UTCIt's starting to hurt the brand, though. It'll always be mega-popular, but it's no longer a true cultural phenomenon. Just look at the box office draw of Episode IX. It's down substantially.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 16:00:52 +0000 UTCI say without sarcasm: When I watched it again a year or two ago, it was worse than I remembered, worse than I thought. I didn't know that was possible. I can see some redeeming parts of Phantom Menace, but... yikes.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 16:00:22 +0000 UTCThat's some nerdy shit.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 15:59:51 +0000 UTCThere's honestly so much wrong with The Last Jedi that I can't possibly begin to wrap my mind around it right now. We'll get there, but I need to rest and meditate a good long while, first. =D
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 15:59:38 +0000 UTCHe's very relatable, I agree. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-25 15:58:28 +0000 UTCSuch a great episode. Always love the star wars ones!
Reuben Barrett
2020-02-25 09:43:34 +0000 UTCI feel as though with The Last Jedi, Disney was like; “Well, you’re all gonna watch it regardless.” They’ll never admit that if it’s true, but it makes you wonder..
Brandon Soto
2020-02-24 21:55:01 +0000 UTCI can't wait for the "group therapy" episode on Attack of the Clones. Time to rip into that movie again, but I won't be watching it beforehand with you guys, lol. You both enjoy that re-view!
Brogan Trull
2020-02-24 05:32:46 +0000 UTCAccording to the updated Star Wars visual dictionary, a miner on Cloud City found the lightsaber and bartered it away. At some point Maz comes across it and because she is Force-sensitive she knew what it was. That is the canon reason for how she came to possess it. It's also fucking stupid and very JJ Abrams.
ZachAttacksGames
2020-02-23 23:33:55 +0000 UTCI had a habit with the prequels where I’d start to rewrite the films in my head after seeing them. I couldn’t help but do the same with the new films. The biggest issue with the new films is that they barely allude to any history beyond the original films. All we know is that Luke started a new Jedi academy and that Kyle Ren destroyed it. We know that there is a New Republic but no absolutely nothing about it. Why not give these new characters some history? Why not have Rey have been a Jedi apprentice that trained under Luke along side Ben? Give her a history that isn’t unnecessarily tied to some great lineage. Maybe she was an orphan discovered by Luke after the battle of Jakku. She trained for much of her life. But then left when she saw that Luke was ignoring Ben’s draw to the dark side. Have her be a reluctant hero thrust back into the fight. Give her some existing conflict with Kylo Ren. Also, while I make no apologies for TLJ, part of the problem with that film was that it was forced to pick up where TFA left off. It meant that rather than setting TLJ a few years later it literally extends the prior story. Say what you will about the prequels, but at least each film seemed to stand on their own from a narrative standpoint. I think the search for Luke should’ve extended into Ep 8 that pushed the story out at least a few months. That would’ve given other story threads more room to breathe. Instead, we got a film that felt the need to focus on the escape of the Resistance. True, that could’ve been handled much better. The slow moving wagon train chase was wrong on so many levels. The use of a ship in hyperspeed to destroy the First Order flagship hurt my brain.
Patrick A Crone
2020-02-23 15:19:39 +0000 UTCDagan is the older brother everyone should have, a very lovable person. too bad for me, because now I have one more podcast to listen to, on my over saturated list 🤣
Marco Maluf
2020-02-23 02:13:41 +0000 UTCI'll just wait until the series is over and binge it. I don't really have any interest in it.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-22 19:15:09 +0000 UTCHe's taken to podcasting unlike anyone I've ever met. And I mean that. I've been podcasting professionally for more than a decade. He slid right into his position and knew exactly what to do, and trust me: You put a mic in front of most people and they won't have the first fucking clue how to do it. I'm glad his skill is shining through.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-22 19:14:55 +0000 UTCWell, I hope you enjoy it. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-22 19:14:13 +0000 UTCThis is some nerdy-ass shit, Ryan!!! =D
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-22 19:14:06 +0000 UTCColin! wtf man, go watch Mandalorian, I hated ep VIII and IX, but the mandalorian is awesome, very original trilogy SW nostalgia.
Marco Maluf
2020-02-22 17:32:22 +0000 UTCAlso, I've been a critic of Dagan's in the past (I commented once on a podcast a few weeks ago it wasn't rude I promise) and I have to applaud the clear effort by Dagan to articulate and drive the conversation. This is a weird gig, and it's impressive how Dagan has adapted. (The gig = podcasting)
Matt tamer
2020-02-22 03:23:21 +0000 UTCJust listening now - the Sacred Symbols game sounds great...I wasn't expecting such an alluring story. Looking forward to the platinum.
Matt tamer
2020-02-22 02:47:47 +0000 UTCI apologize if someone has already mentioned this but a couple of quick comments about Kylo's lightsaber. First, Kylo is not a sith but merely a dark side user. He locates his origin, along with the Knights of Ren, to a much earlier time that mirrors the middle ages of our own- hence the broad sword aesthetic which you very briefly touched upon. I do disagree, though, in that he does wield it that way to some extent- not so much in holding the hilt with both hands but the weight of it that Dagan points out. His dueling is much less fluid, as a result of it's heft than say... Darth Maul for instance. The reason that he has the cross guard is because the kyber crystal inside of the lightsaber is cracked and thus very unstable. As Dagan pointed out, it mirrors his instability. The cross guard functions as a dual ventilation shaft for the excess energy. Yes, you'd have to look at some extra reading material, and I understand your reasons for not doing so, but there's a lot to the movies that they had to cut for time and not necessarily because it's irrelevant. Appreciate you boys as always, thanks for the content.
Ryan B.
2020-02-21 22:30:22 +0000 UTCAgreed 100% !
Captain Canada
2020-02-21 21:29:37 +0000 UTCYeah I agree, Rogue One was amazing. Solo, I liked. But Harrison Ford is Han Solo. I'd rather some original stories in the universe.
Marc Cairney
2020-02-21 20:53:04 +0000 UTCI need to see Rise of Skywalker before I draw any firm conclusions. But I really don't like the prequels. At all.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:51:04 +0000 UTCSee, that's what I would have loved to see.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:49:28 +0000 UTCIt was an awesome glimpse into what could have been... Although Rogue One ruled, and I also liked Solo.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:49:20 +0000 UTCIt's just amazing that Disney even let that happen. Star Wars is too important to fuck around with like that.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:48:59 +0000 UTCWe're glad to fill the void. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:48:41 +0000 UTCWell I'm glad he was able to make it right.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 20:48:22 +0000 UTCThanks for the 4 hours guys, really enjoyed the podcast. I really don’t see how someone can watch the original trilogy, the prequels, and the sequel (?) trilogy and come to the conclusion that the prequels are the worst of the bunch. RoS has a million plot holes and next to zero action to boot, the Last Jedi makes Phantom Menace look coherent, and the Force Awakens was basically a New Hope remastered.
John Balas
2020-02-21 16:43:32 +0000 UTCHey Colin, there's an Interview after Episode 6 with George. And he states Luke did go to the dark side during his confrontation with Vader and the Emporer. I think your idea is probably dead on with what Lucas probably had planned.
Aurang
2020-02-21 15:07:04 +0000 UTCThis was a great episode guys! I really agreed with almost everything you guys said. They destroyed the magic of Star Wars for me overall. But going back to first seeing TFA I was so excited and it really paid off for me. I loved this movie, and actually think it's one of the best in the entire saga. TLJ just took a huge shit on everything and made it clear that Disney really don't care about the franchise. That movie should have been canned as soon as someone seen what was happening and how unhappy the cast was. You'd also image the cast and others were ringing the bell on TLJ. So sad! But yes, watch the Mandelorian. It will restore some faith. Jon Favreau and Taika Waititi killed it.
Marc Cairney
2020-02-21 14:08:57 +0000 UTCPersonally, I think it was insane of Kathleen Kennedy and Disney to go ahead with such a massive franchise trilogy without having a cohesive overarching plan. Rian and JJ both clearly had radically different visions.
Captain Canada
2020-02-21 14:02:23 +0000 UTCThe catalyst for this was a New York Times interview with Rian Johnson where he explicitly stated that there was no predetermined roadmap or framework he needed to follow after Episode 7. Since then, several cast members such as Mark Hamill discussed their frustration with this in various interviews. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/06/movies/star-wars-the-last-jedi-director-rian-johnson.html
Captain Canada
2020-02-21 14:00:03 +0000 UTCA few times throughout this episode, you and Dagan speculate about the overarching plan for this trilogy... Unfortunately, it's been confirmed that there really was no plan. Rian Johnson and several other people involved in the films have publically confirmed that there was no roadmap for Episodes 8 & 9, which is why they feel so disjointed from Episode 7. Rian Johnson was given total creative control over Episode 8's story. This is why he was able to deviate from, or outright contradict, multiple key elements established by JJ in Episode 7. As a result, Episode 9 is a hot mess because JJ had to somehow piece together a third act from the ruins of Rian's movie.
Captain Canada
2020-02-21 13:51:37 +0000 UTCI was lamenting Star Wars Binge Mode being all over and then we get a big old Star Wars Knockback!! I’m moving the opposite direction as the boys on the entries in the latest trilogy after seeing it conclude. One thing is for sure though and it was terribly disjointed as a full story arc. I don’t know how it could ever work with the original trio losing a member to death, one to ego, and the other post cockknocker....
Nick DeBoer
2020-02-21 13:46:15 +0000 UTCFun little bit of info for you Colin, you mentioned that the actor who played Wedge declined to return in this movie. So it may surprise you to know he made a small, albeit underwhelming, cameo in The Rise of Skywalker.
Sam Jones
2020-02-21 13:33:14 +0000 UTCI would watch Rise of Skywalker if I were you, but via a rental. Approach it while prepared to find humor in its absurdity, and I think you'll have a good time. It's not as good as TFA, but it is semi-hilarious to watch Disney just blow their entire proverbial creative "load".
Max Stahl
2020-02-21 11:27:06 +0000 UTCMatt Lanter is such a great Anakin. Clone Wars fixes the chief problem with the prequel trilogy, which is that you never actually like Anakin or see him as a good character (and thus his turn to the Dark Side doesn't feel as tragic). That being said, you could probably get everything you need out of the Clone Wars series from a main plot perspective by watching about 1/4 of the episodes.
JEECE
2020-02-21 06:43:09 +0000 UTCAnd to think you were the one who was always on point about how people said Phantom Menace was good when it came out because they got caught up in it being new Star Wars after a long break.
JEECE
2020-02-21 06:39:49 +0000 UTCI like it!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 06:17:19 +0000 UTC=\
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 06:17:15 +0000 UTCWe don't need a lightsaber broadsword!!!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 06:17:09 +0000 UTCI love that people (cough, Colin) are still pretending Force Awakens was good.
JEECE
2020-02-21 03:19:30 +0000 UTCOf all the people to kill Han, it had to be his stupid-face son.. Besides that, agreed; Good movie.
Brandon Soto
2020-02-21 02:24:56 +0000 UTCI like Kylos lightsaber, but it bothers me the way he uses it. When he locks saber to saber in a fight, he just needs to twist his wrist a bit and it would slash Reys chest.
Alan Ortega-Lopez
2020-02-21 01:09:30 +0000 UTCWe fail to talk about a lot of things! We only touch on what we feel is relevant for us.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:09:29 +0000 UTC=\
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:09:06 +0000 UTCHe's arguably the most interesting character in the new trilogy.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:09:02 +0000 UTCMaybe one day.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:08:49 +0000 UTCOh, that's totally not necessary. I can afford it. But I appreciate the offer. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:08:38 +0000 UTCI agree. I had a good night's sleep after this conversation!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:08:24 +0000 UTCThey are able to login and look as guests, but they don't respond to comments, no.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:08:03 +0000 UTCStar Wars' galaxy is so rich with storytelling opportunities that it surprises me they want to tether it all to this very limited area. What actually showed me this the most was when I got into the Star Wars paper and pencil RPG in the '90s.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-21 01:07:46 +0000 UTCFantastic episode! Thank you for the 4 hours. I have to say you guys failed to discuss the score of a movie once again, or at least Rey’s iconic and adventurous theme song. Nonetheless, very good. Also I would note: the main distinction between the Death Star and Starkiller Base is that the Death Star only ever destroys Alderaan and the cities in Rogue One. Starkiller Base, however, succeeds. It destroys the New Republic capital system, thus securing First Order hold on the galaxy. Everyone seems to dismiss that... Also a nod to the Force Unleashed’s character. ;)
Caleb Greer
2020-02-21 00:44:13 +0000 UTC🙌
Caleb Greer
2020-02-21 00:37:29 +0000 UTCAll hail Lord Jar Jar.
Max Stahl
2020-02-20 23:38:47 +0000 UTCSecond comment sorry. But Finn was a good character who was completely done dirty. He was scared and trying to run away but ultimately faced his worst fear, Kylo ren, in a one on one lightsaber duel even though he knew he would lose. Finn should have been the main character.
Kenneth Oms
2020-02-20 21:49:46 +0000 UTCYou and Dagan need to watch the clone wars animated movie and the cartoon which is getting its final season tomorrow. It’s George Lucas at his best, and he does the character of Anakin a lot of justice and even the prequel era, not the movies, but the lore and the characters.
Kenneth Oms
2020-02-20 21:03:47 +0000 UTCColin, I will give you my Disney plus information if you watch the Mandalorian. Truly, it is one of the great shows. The music and sound effects alone give reason for everyone to watch it. Honestly I think it might be my favorite work of Star Wars besides episode 5 and maybe Rogue One. Obviously you can easily afford it, but you said you didn’t want another streaming service until mighty ducks comes out on Disney plus haha
kevin berger
2020-02-20 20:18:04 +0000 UTCEp 7 was something I legitimately enjoyed the more times I watched it. There were few things I didn’t agree with but they were minor compared to the rest of the film. I would’ve thought Ep 8 would improve upon the things that were left unexplained or unclear but RIAN Johnson’s ego got in the way and Lucasfilm signed off on such a flawed script and an unfinished idea. Because of how Disney and the head of LucasFilm have lazily treated this franchise I loved my whole life just fall apart at the seems, makes me super depressed and has lead to me never support anything Star Wars related ever again. I might be sounding like some kind of man child (which Rian has indeed called Star Wars fans) but Star Wars was always something there for me when I was feeling down and offered a sense of escapism. Now, it has to be “meta”, “diverse”, and “agenda divine” to pander to all audiences. Just talking about Star Wars now to me feels exhausting and makes me want to jump off a cliff.
Mark Zebro, Jr.
2020-02-20 18:48:36 +0000 UTCHey Colin, Do Chris and Dagan see comments on Patreon? Are they able to respond? If not, is there a place that they do read and respond to comments?
McBain
2020-02-20 18:41:47 +0000 UTCCould not agree with you more about small world syndrome. I hate that stuff so much. It's especially annoying that anytime there is a new black character introduced in a series it's immediately assumed it's a child or something. They theorized Finn was Lando's son, which I am so happy they didn't go with, but I believe that in episode IX the black girl introduced ended up being his daughter.
Michael Ferrari
2020-02-20 18:32:46 +0000 UTCNo worries, Colin. having a massive amount of users submitting questions is a good problem to have! I just submit a question when I think I have something possibly interesting to ask and cross my fingers!
Michael Ferrari
2020-02-20 18:29:54 +0000 UTCPerhaps if there was a way for listeners to ask questions and we can vote on them so you see the good ones?
Dread Fort
2020-02-20 18:27:11 +0000 UTCThank you! <3
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:21:26 +0000 UTCI understand. I'm just trying to explain how I select questions, and what folks might do to increase their odds of being chosen. I do my best to be equitable and get as many people involved as I can.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:21:21 +0000 UTCHappy to hear it. We've enjoyed the longer runtimes on our end, too.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:20:54 +0000 UTCDo your work!
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:20:40 +0000 UTCSometimes, we just can't help ourselves.
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:20:33 +0000 UTCPlease enjoy. =)
Colin Moriarty
2020-02-20 18:20:25 +0000 UTCStar Wars knockback episodes are definitely some of the best!
Captain Canada
2020-02-20 17:50:03 +0000 UTCI'm sorry, but it is damn near impossible to ask a completely unique question, considering almost every time I ask, it doesn't have a single question asked yet, I submit and there's like 17.
Michael Ferrari
2020-02-20 17:41:51 +0000 UTCSo very thankful for the depths these pods reach. Really helps the 8-10 hour work days move along.
Alec
2020-02-20 17:24:47 +0000 UTCIt's alright, I dont need to study today. I'll just put this on and play FF13.
Brian Berghuis
2020-02-20 17:15:36 +0000 UTCJesus christ that run time
Real Radec
2020-02-20 17:14:37 +0000 UTCCan’t ever get enough of you guys talking about Star Wars! Been waiting for this topic for a long time.
Corey
2020-02-20 17:06:37 +0000 UTC
