Constellation, Episode 41 | AI Art, Cult Movies, Separating the Art from the Artist, Suffering From Acne (Video)

Ooooh interested af in the "separate the art from the artist" convo. Adding this to the list next.

Devon McCarty

I think there's a good way to do AI art, and a bad way. Shadiversity did a recent thing on how they use AI to generate art, and it's a very involved process with him not only doing many iterations on the prompts, but mixing and matching which tools are used for different steps, and telling the AI what parts of the image to work on for those steps, using his aesthetic sense to guide the AI to generate what he wants. At that point, it becomes just a tool that you're using. Of course, if you just tell it to generate something and you take it unaltered, then that's the wrong way to do AI art.

Kaz Redclaw

I know what you mean. I think it’s because there’s this perception among the LSM crew that we’re on this linear slope upward, that AI is only going to improve and improve until it totally supersedes everything that a human can do. But I don’t think that’s self-evident at all. Chris said something a few episodes of SS back like “Well, yeah, a CEO can’t click a button and create a game *yet*”—implying that such a day would come in the future. But I’m really not sure I buy that. For all we know, AI has gotten as good as it's going to get at this point. Look: Ai art generators still can’t really deal with hands, man. You can refine it through inpainting and LoRAs if you know what you’re doing, but as its own standalone tool, something like Stable Diffusion consistently screws up hands to this day, and I don’t know if it’s ever really going to get much better at it. Just because the technology has improved a lot in the past few years doesn’t mean that it will continue to improve on the same level for years to come—that’s not really how tech works. Moore's Law is dead, after all. (And yeah, I realize that's kind of apples to oranges, but you see what I mean—progression is not always linear.) That said, I’m totally with you about the utility of AI as a tool for artists—it’s great as a way to automate boring/repetitive tasks. I mostly mess around in the 3D space, and using AI to create PBR textures has been really useful for me. I’m also excited about AI tools for things like UV unwrapping or even animating—there’s a new-ish app called Cascadeur that can help automate animation keyframes that has some insane potential. It’s the kind of thing that still requires some creative input and know-how, but makes things way easier/faster for anyone who even has some interest in animation. That's the kind of thing that truly excites me—it makes the boring parts of art easier so you can be more creative.

Superhero Jagganath

Every time AI art pops up on LSM it’s kind of frustrating. Not because I don’t see where you all are coming from. The argument about the “Soul” of art is a philosophical one I don’t necessarily disagree with. However, repeatedly there is this scapegoating of a nefarious character who has no artistic skill, perhaps they are a CEO and they’re going push a button and everyone’s gonna buy it up and it will ruin the industry. Maybe? But I don’t see this happening. Yet the conversation is always targetted at this idea of spontaneously created work with prompts written by the “untalented”. There are a lot of artists with years or decades of experience (eg. myself), who know how to make art “the hard way” but can see ways AI can be infused in very specific workflows to produce an even bolder vision. Not everyone is just pushing an I WIN button here. There is so much grey in this conversation that is never even broached because of just the very militant black and white thinking born of a lack of understanding of what the actual workflow is for a visual artist.

Dan P

perfect to listen to around middle of the week thing

Pyo

Have to respectfully disagree with Ramon saying that Chapelle is obsessed with the trans subject. I don't think he's obsessed. It's society that is obsessed and he's just doing what comics do best, observe and respond. Comedians are in many ways beholden to the ideas of society, otherwise their jokes wouldn't hit because people couldn't relate. And when you can't go a single day in society without hearing or seeing something about trans anymore, its pretty easy to focus on it. I think Dave's smart, and honestly concerned that the obsession with the subject isn't good for society. When its something rarely encountered during most people's daily lives yet is talked about and pushed like its this common thing you can't ignore the imbalance. I think he's just pointing that out, just like he did on his show. As for it being harsh, that's comedy. The harsher the commentary the harder I laugh, even if the jokes are about my own culture. When people have opinions like this I can't help but wonder if it stems from being surrounded by far left progressive ideas. Its wild how living in different locations can effect the way some people think in a dramatic way. I also think this isn't for you then, don't listen to it. The worst person at the comedy club is the one taking things far too seriously and being offended. Everyone is there to have fun, why aren't you?

Sorta Serious Gaming

Bottle Rocket really is fantastic and it’s awesome to see the progression of his career. I challenge anyone who thinks Owen Wilson isn’t funny and hasn’t watched Bottle Rocket.

Micah! Since you mentioned Movie 42... have you watched: "Everything Everywhere All at Once"? It would kinda fall in line with that stuff. Weird, over the top movie. It has a lot of comedy although it would kinda be somewhere between a Comedy and a tinge of Drama.

Calcifer

Look, I’m not a huge fan or enthusiast about AI art, however… I think the takes given here about work created with AI lacking actual creativity because of the human element, or about how it’s not actual expression of human creativity, or about how creating shit with AI doesn’t make you a creative…. it comes off kinda… pretentious (not you guys; the concepts). Jaffe would call it “gatekeeping.” Of course I’m not as impressed by incredible AI art as by human art (actually that’s not exactly accurate. Some AI art impressed me way more than human art. But the person who made it isn’t as impressive, sure), but I don’t think it’s necessarily less creative. There are many people (prob myself included) who have a vivid picture in their mind of a picture they’d wanna create, but they simply DO NOT have the talent for drawing or painting. It’s like “oh if creating your art didn’t require natural drawing coordination, it’s not art.” Or “if you didn’t manually draw the sky, it’s not art,” but then where do u draw the line? Is using the blur tool in Adobe not cheating then? Since it’s automating smtn that’s hard to do physically. Or just clicking the Layer and checking a box to automatically give it an outline, is that not cheating? Where do u draw the line for “if it’s too easy, it’s not really art?” In my mind I’ve come up with sick pieces of art when I was younger that I would’ve loved to create. But I tried, and it turns out I naturally lack the ability to physically draw well. But the creative part — seeing the image in my mind — I do have. So it’s a question of limited skill. But if I can make it with AI, that CAN be (but isn’t always) equally an expression of creativity. ESPECIALLY since the really impressive and custom AI art you see isn’t generated with just one prompt. You generate several initial images, then perhaps you throw them out and regenerate, then you pick one u like (if any), and you begin to refine with more prompts, over and over and over. Sometimes dozens of iterations where you select one small part of the image and then write a prompt just to alter that small part (“inpainting”). And you’re continuously refining it… “make the sky darker and more cosmic”, “add a beam of light in the middle,” and then u keep refining it. The actual CREATIVE part still very much exists. And also, if you think there isn’t an art and a skill to Prompt Engineering, then you’ve never properly used generative AI. People who use it seriously don’t just type one prompt and then boom that’s it. The argument just feels kinda “elitist”… like “your shit will never be as good cuz u didn’t do it by hand.” How is that any different than if I said “Dagan, if you use the dodge tool in Photoshop rather than manually darken every pixel u wanna darken, you’re cheating” or “using the airbrush brush in Adobe is cheating.. you should manually draw the darker pixels, then manually draw a ring of lighter more transparent pixels around it, etc etc.” It’s a tool. Yea, if someone types one prompt in Midjourney and then posts that image as if it’s groundbreaking, sure that’s dumb. But when someone refines an image 100 times in minute detail to make it look like what they envision, that absolutely does require creativity and the human element. Even just the prompt engineering is a skill. Yes, the work itself is easier than drawing manually, but that “human element” and “creativity” can still very much be present. Just like using Layers and custom brush presets in photoshop is easier than manually drawing every dot like an oil painting. I still love you, even though I called your take pretentious 😇. (And I’m not even an AI art guy lol. I’m an amateur AI tinkerer from the technical and philosophical perspective)

Ben

Am I the only one who can instantly tell which topics are Micah’s before even watching the episode lol

Ben

Embrace the changing technology. Water tastes better from a faucet than it does from a bucket hoisted from the well. The negativity comes from fear and misunderstanding. I saw all the classic art teachers do the same thing 20 years ago when the world shifted away from easels and onto Adobe Illustrator. First you resist, then you understand, then you embrace. Us left-brained people don't gatekeep our professions though. The code I write vs the code someone else wrote and I took directly from Github (read: stole), that's embraced. I WANT you to better understand your computer and your phone. I WANT you to be able to self-service your technologies instead of involving me for all your needs. Fragile egos are rampant in creative fields because #1 there are way more left-brained people than there are left-brained jobs and #2 those jobs and skills are rarely respected like they should be in society. Not to mention modern day mental illness is synonymous with creativity. Yet another potential threat to your skillset can be shattering. The real questions here should be, how do we ensure that AI art tools are being taught in classrooms so that all our creatives are well-equipped to create in a modern day? Will AI replace jobs or just decrease production times and therefore have a positive economic impact? Time will tell, but your resistance matters not.

Jordan Falduto

+1 for cutting out dairy and soy for skin problems. you don't necessarily have to cut all dairy. for a lot of people, myself included, regular butter is ok as well as small amount of half n half or heavy cream in coffee

PRETENTIEUX

Balls out is great, So many great quotes and scenes. It’s right up there with Hot Rod, Death to smoochy and UHF. That’s my Mount Rushmore of cult classics. If people consider fight club as a cult classic, that would be my George Washington though

Michael Thew

Micah, My wife has dealt with the same thing in her family and has fixed her issue by cutting out dairy and soy. After doing that her acne has completely gone away and she also feels way better than she's ever had in life. Just throwing it out there might not help but wanted to share. Thanks,

Levelupbrady

BIG shout out to Ramon and the Barry Gordys The Last Dragon....SHO NUFF!!!

Halph Pint

Raiiiiidersss!!!

Liquid Metal Guts

Mel Gibson would be easily cancelled if he wasn't so god damn talented. He is a top tier director as well as still an incredible actor. I just finished watching The Continental and he was fucking amazing.

Luke Silletta