Buffy The Vampire Slayer 6x19 "Seeing Red" Full Reaction
Added 2021-04-30 21:31:01 +0000 UTCNobody talk to me
Comments
I wonder if part of the shock comes from the fact that, up to this point in the series, this show doesn't feel like the kind of show that would go there. it's a shock because until it happens, it doesn't feel like a place this show would go. What bugs me is when people say that it doesn't fit Spike's character to do that. Yes, it does. It's been extremely well foreshadowed, to the point where it does seem almost strange that we don't expect it. I hope this makes sense. Almost, except tha for a lot of people, AR is a lot more visceral than a shooting, or breaking someone's neck, like Angel did to Jenny. We are desensitized to a lot of types of murder more than we are to sexual violation. The shock might be less about Spike doing that as it is about the writers gong there.
Raven Dark
2023-01-16 04:38:52 +0000 UTCI was going to catch up with your reactions but I knew this episodes was coming and well most of season six really (then I saw on you tube that you had gotten to the end already). While I like some aspects of "Reality is the Big Bad" plot what I really dislike about this season nowadays is how unnecessary and forced some things are and how several characters act out of character several times. Still here in this episode 1. Tara did not have to die to make willow spiral in to darkness there where other ways to do that. And 2. There where other ways to have deal with the Spike, he did not have to attempt what he did.
Ian Swallow
2021-06-05 22:01:19 +0000 UTCI almost always skip this episode. It's just rough and intense and I hate it. I understand why it's important for the storyline and all but it is too raw. While I still like Spike as a character for example I hate this element. But there are arguments that while not for the rape attempts do help explain why it isn't the most atrocious violation ever.
Kara Michelle
2021-05-21 21:39:44 +0000 UTCI know you said you were happy and Willow and Tara but still know the Buffyverse, things can go bad,so you were worried that some bad could happen, but I'm sure you NEVER thought it would have been this bad,so nothing could have prepared you for what you saw in the last 30 seconds. At least you got your wish about Willow fucking up Warren. If anyone deserved the wrath of Willow, it's him. HATE that guy. But great reactions to the AR and the ending. As terrible as things go in this ep, I still really think it's a good one.
Val
2021-05-11 01:09:11 +0000 UTCI think it's partly that, for a lot of people, rape is basically seen as a worse crime than murder (whether or not they should is another topic entirely that I don't really want to get into). And partly as you said, if it's not on screen, it's easier to ignore or forget. I mean, realistically speaking, Anya has probably hurt/ killed more people that both Spike and Angelus combined, considering she was a vengeance demon for like a thousand years or whatever (certainly a lot longer than Spike or Angel have been "alive"), but it's pretty much never mentioned outside of a passing comment, usually from Anya about some punishment she doled out back in the day. But the Scoobies don't have any issue hanging out with her, I guess due to a combination of her dating Xander for a while and also because she hasn't tried to hurt/ kill them or people they care about?
Nicole Iannone
2021-05-04 00:45:25 +0000 UTCThe reactions people have towards Spike after that attempted rape scene honestly always amazes me. Spike has been murdering people for over a century, and as lately of season 6, when he thought his chip had stopped working, he went right back to killing people (or at least tried to). Yet, that bathroom scene is what is too much for people. I think it goes to show how readily we are willing to ignore people's cruelties as long as we don't have to see them, or as long as they are funny. I've seen the same reactions from viewers towards certain GoT characters.
Alexandra Wege
2021-05-03 18:10:05 +0000 UTCDo their characters ever meet each other? I'm trying to remember, but I think they don't even lay eyes on each other in the whole show...
Khanach
2021-05-02 07:58:14 +0000 UTCIt glossed my mind because I never expected them to add Amber to hurt us more
Liam Catterson
2021-05-01 15:29:27 +0000 UTCThis is one of the few episodes that I pretty much always skip on rewatch/when reactors get to it (though I try to listen to their ending thoughts), its a very rough episode to get through, not because its bad/dumb/etc, but its just A Lot. As a couple other commenters have mentioned, James in particular took this scene *really* badly. Apologies for the incoming wall of text but this is his words from an interview on this scene in particular: 'The truth about that scene is that Joss, throughout the entire series, was asking his writing team to come up with their worst day. The day that they didn’t talk about, the day they were ashamed about, the day that was too painful to talk about, their dark secret, the one that keeps them up at night, the day they hurt someone that they regret, or the day they were grossly humiliated. “What are your scars?” basically. And then slap fangs on top of that dark secret and tell the world about it. This is an act of bravery and vulnerability every single episode. In the case of that scene, one of the female writers, in college, had been broken up with by her boyfriend, and decided that if she went over to his place, and if they made love one more time, everything would be fine. And so she tried to do that, and really kind of jumped the guy, and he had to push her off and say, “No, you have to leave now.” The thinking I think was that since Buffy was a superhero and completely capable of pushing Spike through a wall that it was kind of the same thing, and you could flip the sexes. My argument was that, actually, when anyone is watching Buffy, they are Buffy. That’s the vicarious experience that we’re offering. And so the audience, especially the female audience, they are not superheroes, but they are Buffy. And so I’m attempting to rape them. And that doesn’t quite work so well. It was the hardest day of my professional life. I was curled up in a fetal position in between takes. I can’t watch scenes like that. I choose not to. I won’t go to a movie that has something like that. It’s a specific hot button for me. It just really makes me crazy. It was really hard. It was just unbelievably hard. But again I’m glad we did it. Spike was evil, and I think a lot of people forgot about that. Joss was constantly trying to remind the audience, “Look, guys, I know he’s charming, but he’s evil.” He’s a bad boyfriend. It would be bad to date a guy like this. And I think he wanted to reinforce that in the most dramatic way imaginable.' It's a very interesting interview, but unfortunately there are some spoilers in other parts of it for the rest of season 6 and 7 so I don't know if adding a link to it will count as spoiling the show and I don't want to risk it.
Nicole Iannone
2021-05-01 12:56:47 +0000 UTC*Hugs* We’ve all been there mate.
Liam Skoda
2021-05-01 12:54:50 +0000 UTCAlso, and I point this out on every reaction to this episode, because in the scheme of things it's only a small point, but it still really, really irks me - the figurine in the nerd's lair that Buffy is yechs at is a comic book character called Vampirella. For a self proclaimed feminist show, the writers sure as hell don't seem to know their feminist comic book creator history, because the character of Vampirella was co-created by Trina Robbins, one of the most important and influential feminist comic book artists, writers, and producers of the 1960s, 70s and 80s.
Claire Eyles
2021-05-01 09:28:29 +0000 UTCThe thing with Spike, besides him not having a soul and being amoral, is that he's also a romantic in the 19th century sense of the word. Being made into a Vampire would've just warped that even further. Romanticism in the 19th century was like "I love you so much, let me neglect my betrothed so I can obsessively stalk you & then go to a witch to be given something that will make you love me back, but the witch will betray me into ripping off one of your appendages so you'll die in my arms" (literally the plot of one of the Romantic Ballets).
Claire Eyles
2021-05-01 09:22:24 +0000 UTC*whispers* we're love you we're sorry....
Bixgirl1
2021-05-01 08:30:44 +0000 UTCThey met during this season, and started dating after that. They were together for 7 years, actually made a really lovely couple, and have remained good friends. :)
Claire Eyles
2021-05-01 08:30:08 +0000 UTCYeah.... Hard episode. What's really hard about it, I think, is because the two fucking horrible things that happen here, the sexual violence and specifically the sexual assault that Spike carries out against Buffy, and the shooting of Buffy and Tara, are so mundane. By which I mean, this set of nightmares are real. They happen to real people, all the time. This is all deeply rooted in reality. Spike's assault of Buffy when she ends their relationship, is rooted in the fact that many sexual assaults are perpetrated by an intimate partner, or an ex intimate partner, and the fact that women (people) are at particular risk of violence and abuse when they leave abusive relationships. Abusers lash out when they realise they no longer have the same control of their partner anymore. It's one of the reasons it's hard for people to leave abusive partners. It's risky. As to Warren's shooting of Buffy, when she has stood up to his bad behaviour, and held him accountable, and because of his own inadequacy, her actions made him feel humiliated, and his response is to find the most dangerous weapon he can, to hurt her with. It's worth bearing in mind that it's this kind of scenario women (people) worry about when standing up to, or even just talking about the bad (or even criminal) behaviour) of men.
Briony Addey
2021-05-01 08:10:20 +0000 UTCLiam, I hope your ok... Know that we all feel sickened by what the Writers did, with Buffy, with Tara, Willow, Xan, & Spike. They made Seeing Red, for Stupid reasons, unecasary & JM. Was sure he would be hated, by others especially the Fans, he feared the worst, when Seeing Red aired. 🤦🏼♂️🙎🏼♂️🙎🏼♀️
Melissa Amato
2021-05-01 04:44:28 +0000 UTCThe Actors of Buffy couldn't understand why the Writers drove the Episode thoughtless, & too much for the Fangdom, but He who shall not be named, pushed them to their limits. Many including the Actors thought it was way too much. & JM. Just had a son, & needed the Job. Even tho he got ill during, & after the scene, Call in Clem to add levity to Spike's Crypt scene later, as Xan, was called in to help Buffy.
Melissa Amato
2021-05-01 04:27:42 +0000 UTCOnce upon a time, is fun, love OUAT💗 Always made me giggle, & feel good, ok Graham not so much & Belle getting shot by Hook, was just to make Captain Hook look bad. But Rumple can beat up Hook, after all he got away with. I adore Hook, I feel for Belle, but unjustified is the blood feud between the two. 6 Season for Buffy was rough, not just on the Characters but the Actors, the Writers nearly killed JM. With the demand for the Buffy & Spike bathroom scene. An old injury popped off, in his neck, Sarah cried out to see if he was alright, but in reading the scene JM didn't want to do it. They had to stop filming JM. Needed Therapy after shooting that disgusting scene. Seeing Red is about reaching the edge, just before you hit Complete bottom off the cliff. Like when a wolf reaches, blood thirst, & can only see Red, before attaching it's prey.
Melissa Amato
2021-05-01 04:16:56 +0000 UTCOh here we go
Liv
2021-05-01 04:14:14 +0000 UTCThere is also Legends of Tomorrow coming up, on the CW. Hey Sara Lance beam me up.
Melissa Amato
2021-05-01 03:59:44 +0000 UTCLiam, I dreaded you watching this decent for us all into the Hellmouth. I knew you'd be too sensitive. & I just wanted to give you air hugs. You should watch something fun Agents of Shields having a better out come.
Melissa Amato
2021-05-01 03:57:33 +0000 UTCRewatch the intro credits for this episode Liam ... they did a "such a joss" thing to do 😔😔
Devon Martin
2021-05-01 03:55:17 +0000 UTCMmm yes, reactor anguish sustains me
Derek Garrard
2021-05-01 03:50:25 +0000 UTCThis episode breaks my heart no matter how many times I watch it. I never thought when watching a show like Buffy that the villain I would hate most would be a human.
Shakia
2021-05-01 03:47:30 +0000 UTCI fucking wasn't going to cry this time. Damnit Catterson!!!! You OK? It's been 25 years and I am still NOT OK about it, so you have time. :)
KiwiJello
2021-05-01 03:36:36 +0000 UTCFirst of all, a big virtual hug to you! FYI, I reference an episode from season 2 of Angel below. I agree with all of your thoughts post episode. Spike’s actions in this episode still makes me tense up, even on repeated viewings. In my opinion, yes, he is charismatic and badass character, but he’s also an evil, soulless, obsessed animalistic creature. He just happens to have shackles on in the form of the chip. We want to believe he truly loves Buffy, but after this episode, it’s hard to believe it. Definitely seems more like obsession. I think it was Angel season 2 episode “Dear Boy” where Angel tells Darla that as Angelus, he never truly loved her because he didn’t have a soul. Now that may not be the lore for all vampires in this universe, but I am apt to agree with that. What’s even worse though (in my opinion) is that Warren does have a soul and a conscience and is an even more evil and vile human being!
Free Your Geek
2021-05-01 02:58:05 +0000 UTCOh Liam, how are you doing? I knew this would be tough, as it is for everyone, especially first viewing. I still remember the shock when this aired. Amber is even in the opening credits and then this happens. So cruel. That side, I admired the show for tackling gun violence head on like this. We in the uk are so lucky this isn’t something we have to really think about, but seeing as it’s so different in the US I admired them for showing the true dangers of guns. And then there’s Spike. As he’s been one of my favourites in the series, I hate this is included. It’s harrowing every time. Yet again it’s making an important point to its audience, many of whom at the time were fairly young adults and that’s that sexual violence is a very real fear for women and having the strongest woman (physically) on the show struggle to stop it and fight him off really hits hard. It repulses the viewer and it should. That aside, I hate that they had spike do this. Oh and also Xander criticising Buffy for sleeping with spike early on is toxic too. The whole climb on me comment makes me so mad. It’s not his business and like the last episode his possessiveness really doesn’t sit well with me. A hard episode to watch every time.
Victoria E (vickster5001)
2021-05-01 01:46:10 +0000 UTCi'm the opposite, it's the whole reason i'm here
Anastasia Bartocha
2021-05-01 01:41:40 +0000 UTCI watched this time… but I was watching the series when it first aired… and it took me years after Seeing Red to go back and watch the end of season 6 and all of season 7.
Tracy Dale
2021-05-01 01:14:01 +0000 UTCOh my god. I don't want to watch this...
Raven Dark
2021-05-01 00:48:55 +0000 UTCYup, this whole sequence of episodes is why I usually skip S6 on re-watches, even with favorite reactors.
FernWithy
2021-05-01 00:44:39 +0000 UTCI’m sure it’s uncomfortable but someone’s gotta play a rapist in movies, tv shows, etc.
Rey Gallogo
2021-05-01 00:03:07 +0000 UTCI’m so sorry 😢 I legit hate this friggin episode.
Tracy Dale
2021-05-01 00:02:34 +0000 UTCOh no....
Liam Catterson
2021-04-30 23:41:13 +0000 UTC*hugs*
Kelly Walker
2021-04-30 23:30:23 +0000 UTCJames really hated doing that scene....he has it in his contracts now to make sure he never gets written into that kind of scene again
Glorie Bluestein
2021-04-30 23:30:03 +0000 UTCEveryone seems to forget the episode where Spike was gonna feed a chained up Buffy to Drusilla if she didn't say she loved him. This is who Spike is, and has been since he was sired.
Matthew Garrison-Perkins
2021-04-30 23:25:31 +0000 UTCMy goodness Liam you have finally got to this moment ... one of the most difficult episodes of this series to watch. Just when you are thinking that attempted r was going to be the biggest issue of this episode, that devastating ending happen. This episode was really as dark as this season has been. Sending you virtual hugs and can’t wait to watch your reaction to this.
Tia
2021-04-30 23:08:35 +0000 UTCIf I remember right, Adam Busch and Amber Benson were dating at the time Warren shot Tara, so it makes the whole thing even weirder.
Foamy
2021-04-30 22:58:54 +0000 UTCThis is such a hard episode. Big hugs.
Whisper_dvm
2021-04-30 22:54:11 +0000 UTChttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kQp1uxz5a0&ab_channel=Mers
Foamy
2021-04-30 22:33:59 +0000 UTCWaiting and dreading and here it is. Just hit play to witness the pain.
Matthew Garrison-Perkins
2021-04-30 22:29:38 +0000 UTCIt did....
Liam Catterson
2021-04-30 22:08:18 +0000 UTCHate to say it but that karma teasing domi has come back to bite you...
GaveUp
2021-04-30 22:01:09 +0000 UTCAll these years later and this episode still hurts. 💜
ChaosBleeds
2021-04-30 21:49:49 +0000 UTCOh, God. It's arrived.
Foamy
2021-04-30 21:43:21 +0000 UTC*sending Liam preemptive hugs before I go watch the reaction*
Yesmydog
2021-04-30 21:38:44 +0000 UTCRefresh.. Refresh.. yesss heartbreak, here I come 💔 ... runs back... Liam!! Did you not see Amber Benson in the intro??
CeNedra
2021-04-30 21:38:27 +0000 UTC
