Early Access - Vinland Saga | Reaction & Review 1x18 "Out of The Cradle"
Added 2022-05-07 03:24:48 +0000 UTC
Comments
My favorite line of the series so far is "this man's soul cannot be saved through the trials you provide." That shit is so raw
Mahni Alizadeh
2022-05-09 03:24:18 +0000 UTCI thought it was really interesting to hear your perspective of Christianity present in the show and how the priest does not embody your take of what Christianity sees as true love. I had to attend religious school my entire life, and there is some truth in what you’re saying - that the priest isn’t an entirely accurate portrayal of what a Christian priest would believe or say from that time. Here’s my take on the priest, and maybe I’m wrong because I don’t know what happens next - I think he’s very jaded and perhaps even used to be a traditionalist. Seeing all the horrors of humanity, being so close to the king and all, may have warped his philosophy. Does he even realize that he’s a contradiction? Perhaps that’s another reason why he’s an alcoholic, because it’s how he copes with the cruel world and also how he’s now split from the original philosophy that he is currently tasked to teach. The world’s reality doesn’t line up with his role, but it is still his role. So his version of “true love” is caring for someone else regardless of their relationship to him. I think that’s it’s a challenging concept, but it is beautiful and it’s sad that it is heresy when compared with the constructs of organized religion. Maybe that’s the point. Why does that idea challenge organized religion? Wasn’t that Jesus’ whole thing? Then you think about crusades. Religion’s message versus organized religion. Ragnar loved Canute so much, that the priest considered it discrimination (especially upon reflecting on what happened to Anne’s village) I actually found some beauty in that statement. Categorization doesn’t change the sentiment. Just because the priest called Ragnar’s love for Canute “discrimination” doesn’t change his strong feelings for Canute. It is only shifting perspectives to see the world a different way. And I found the beauty in, from almost a bird’s eye view, the fact that someone can love another person so much that it can actually be considered discrimination - that comparison alone just speaks to the strength of the feelings present and how powerful human emotions and connections can be. I don’t think it’s particularly grimdark.
Sarah S
2022-05-07 14:52:46 +0000 UTCWhat an amazing discussion. I knew you would love this episode and have some really good insights. You touched on all the stuff i hoped you would, really great reaction🔥
MOB12
2022-05-07 12:33:53 +0000 UTCFunny enough you dont seem to know alot about the history of christianity.
Jonathan baez
2022-05-07 12:29:55 +0000 UTCThis episode is perhaps my sole and biggest issue with Vinland Saga. The priest is simply atrocious. I have read the comment above finding the priest's speech fascinating. It also brings up good points explaining as to why that speech is in fact sickening for me. I'm a Eastern Orthodox Christian and that priest is anything but a Christian priest judging from his words. I do realise that the setting is mere decades before Patriarch of Rome officially broke away and started their own version of Christianity, but even that can't explain how that priest is pretty much on verge of heresy with his explanation of love. Nah, it is heresy. It's so wrong from Christianity's point of view I don't even know where to begin. I'm sure Catholics and even Protestants would agree. I get Bhuddist vibes if anything. Priest even fails to distinguish between physical body and soul when speaking how that dead guy is embodiment of love as he will never discriminate. Of course he won't. He's dead. There is nothing a dead man's soul can do to affect physical world. That body of his is simply existing there. Passively. Like sun and snow. That is not Christian love. Passive existence is not love. Love doesn't have to be indiscriminate to still be love. In fact, people capable of such love are called saints in our tradition. That has nothing to do with official recognition as a saint, btw. Indiscriminate love is not the condition for that. Not to say it doesn't matter, but anyway. So we have an alcoholic priest who is losing his faith and falling into heresy being the official mentor for a prince? Like, wtf? I am not sure which region/church district would be responsible for the North in these times, but surely they haven't gone mad. Mad to the point of sending that thing to a court to take propagate Christianity to a prince. A whole prince. Second in line too. The political significance alone should be enough to send someone who can actually fulfill their duties. Or at least someone older. And boom, the result of that heretic speech is prince Canute turning away from God. Great job priest. Awesome. Well done. Unbelievable. With a heresy too. Now I imagine all the people watching this who have no idea of what Christianity is and thinking "hey, that's a cool and relatable concept". It irritates me to no end. Since our country is 99.999% atheist/bhuddist/shinto all mixed together producing this weird breed of people who genuinely do not care and just follow traditions cuz why not, pretty much no one knows Christianity. Urgh... So frustrating. Nicholai-do in Ochanomizu is recognised as state's important cultural heritage, and yet people don't even know that it is also headquarters for Japanese Orthodox Church. Which is Eastern Orthodox Church. We have this tradition of calling organisations by the name of the country so people get confused sometimes. Russian Orthodox, Armenian Orthodox, US Orthodox, Japanese Orthodox, etc., we all the same. That's the level of knowledge people have here. Nonexistent level of knowledge. And we get this episode. Ragnar did not love the villagers who were killed to keep prince safe, but so what? He ain't a saint now, is he? That doesn't mean he did not love Canute. Setting prerequisites for love to be unconditional only, then looking around and finding none in people to then declare that love doesn't exist in humans? Bruh... Say what you want but that is 100% NOT Christian view on the matter. That's my problem with the episode. I'm not saying everyone must accept Christianity as the only truth, but I do demand it being portrayed accurately. Because otherwise people can't even make a choice of whether to believe in what Christianity says or not. Since they won't even know what Christianity says on the matter. Heretical priest being the only Christian priest we see on screen is just... maddening almost.
石原 悟
2022-05-07 12:16:23 +0000 UTCI don't cry but I always get the chills when Canute says "it's as if the fog has been lifted" or when Canute picks up the snow, the score there is perfect and considering how beautiful this episode is I can see how someone would be able to shed a tear watching it.
Rudi Gonçalves
2022-05-07 07:59:12 +0000 UTCI totally agree, this and Anne’s episode are also my favorites of this season, these two episodes are just out-of-this-world good. Does anyone else get really emotional over this episode? I’m not sure why, but this one totally gets me. I’ve rewatched it so many times, and I cry nearly every time. I’ve also found that I cry at something different each time that I watch this one. It just hits different. A huge contributing factor is the amazing score and the placement of the score. The music swells at exactly the right moments in this episode... I feel so overwhelmed when the priest talks to Canute about Ragnar and the true meaning of love. The writing of this series is absolutely masterful. I know I haven’t watched or read ALL the classics, but episodes like this and Anne’s are some of the most impressive anime episodes I’ve ever watched. I’m an anime only for this series, and I’m so excited for what’s in store
Sarah S
2022-05-07 05:36:24 +0000 UTC(I copied this) I found the priest's speech fascinating. From what I understand, he explains that death is love, because death does not discriminate: it loves everyone equally. He says it: the dead accept everything, without ever complaining: death treats everyone the same way. In Buddhism we would speak of equanimity. He speaks literally about it but it is also a metaphor (the death of the ego), it obviously also speaks about selfish love, the one who wants to possess, who loves one and not another: who discriminates. He talks about it when he explains that it is like worshipping a king while whipping a slave, or when he says that Ragnar placed the Prince above everything, even his life: selfish love hierarchizes, has limits. That's why the Priest told the two brothers that their filial love was not the love he was looking for, when they told him they couldn't have this relationship with anyone. This love is a "masturbation in pairs" (Sartre), the wise loves all while consuming himself in his mystical love, disappearing to reveal the loved one. A poem by Djalāl ad-Dīn Rûmî (which I translate), perfectly comments his speech: « Men are like the three butterflies in front of a candle flame. The first one approaches it and says: "I know love." The second one comes to touch the flame with his wings and says: "I know the burning of love." The third one throws itself into the heart of the flame and consumes itself. Only he knows true love. » Or, in a more Christian register, the Father « makes rain fall on the righteous and the unrighteous » (Matthew 5 : 44-45), without discrimination... The Prince and the Priest will end on an almost pantheistic note, seeing love in everything (snow, sky, etc.): Nature does not judge, she is for all the same, like death. She is love, she gives herself to everyone. Man cuts, hierarchizes, divides, discriminates, and breaks unity. The Prince will find his answer at the end of the episode in deciding to build his salvation here on earth and now, saying that he no longer needs to wait for the Father's good will. An almost Gnostic conclusion... An almost Luciferian rebellion.
MCH
2022-05-07 05:24:47 +0000 UTC“Until then, take it easy” - the missing piece 🧩😂
xyz
2022-05-07 04:19:24 +0000 UTCVoice of a certain "based king" coming out of Canute's mouth, love to hear it!
Squidlord
2022-05-07 04:17:04 +0000 UTC"Canute's Awakening" as it is sometimes called is one of my absolute favorite monologues in basically any show. He really just breaks down and rejects one of the most jarring contradictions in classical interpretations of Christianity. Plus it basically outlines a major theme of this entire show, which I'd rather wait until the seasons over to write out my thoughts on.
Shmengels
2022-05-07 04:15:10 +0000 UTCYou're spot on about more casual anime watchers jumping on Vinland assuming it to be another battle centric show. Vinland actually flew under the radar when it was airing because IIRC it was released on Amazon Prime, not Crunchyroll or Netflix (someone correct me if I'm wrong) and it was massively underrated.
Polygon
2022-05-07 04:13:58 +0000 UTCIncredible episode for Canute 👑
elliot
2022-05-07 04:10:11 +0000 UTC
